Talk:My Neighbour Totoro (play)
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![]() | A fact from My Neighbour Totoro (play) appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 10 December 2022 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:
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Did you know nomination
[edit]- The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by RoySmith (talk) 22:04, 3 December 2022 (UTC)
- ... that Totoro will give you sore cheeks? Source: "First, a warning: you will leave the Royal Shakespeare Company's stage adaptation of My Neighbour Totoro with sore cheeks." The Week on Stage: From My Neighbour Totoro to Marvellous
- ALT1: ... that Totoro has become more relevant due to COVID-19 and climate change? Source: "'Because of global warming, it's more important for future children' ... those concerns are very pressing for audiences watching in 2022 ...'Totoro has got more pertinent since the lockdown. It's so of our time.'" Totoro, the Catbus and the fight to save the natural world
- ALT2: ... that Totoro had a week of rehearsals without the script? Source: "'The script didn't even get brought into the room until the second week'." Turning anime classic My Neighbour Totoro into theatre: 'It's got to be its own thing on stage'
- ALT3: ... that Totoro uses new wind spirits? Source: "In the end, the puppeteers are not mechanical, but nor are they traditional Japanese Bunraku puppet performances either – McDermott and his crew have created their own style of puppetry, which they have called 'wind spirits'." My Neighbour Totoro at the Barbican: how the RSC turned a cult cartoon into autumn's must-see theatre show
- ALT4: ... that Totoro has a human field of corn? Source: "The puppeteers are a kind of murmuration too: they become a human field of corn, swaying as one, then invisible forces from another realm, weaving among these humans." My Neighbour Totoro review – dazzling staging of the Studio Ghibli classic
- Reviewed: Skyrush
5x expanded by Sdrqaz (talk). Self-nominated at 22:26, 19 November 2022 (UTC).
General: Article is new enough and long enough |
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Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems |
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Hook eligibility:
- Cited:
- Interesting:
- Other problems:
QPQ: Done. |
Overall:
only ALT2 is clear and interesting as is, others are perhaps too cryptic (e.g what does the colloquialism "sore cheeks" mean? "human field of corn" and "new wind spirits", need explanation ...) created in September, expanded recently, but c. 3-fold past 7 days, and 5-fold in c. 30 days which is more than the required 7.Unfortunately fails on the newness criteria, (as far as I can tell). -Bogger (talk) 18:31, 30 November 2022 (UTC)
- @Bogger: I used DYKcheck to check and it's telling me that 5x expansion began on November 13, which is within seven days of November 19. Maybe one or the other check is inaccurate here? Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 13:41, 1 December 2022 (UTC)
- @Sdrqaz: ok I had compared the raw files, but comparison should have been done on the prose. My bad. -Bogger (talk) 14:05, 1 December 2022 (UTC)
- The hooks still need attention. Even with ALT2, maybe new plays often work without a script in early stages (Workshop production), so it's not interesting enough? something like...
- ALT5:... that Totoro's production team makes extensive use of puppets, so that audience will want to "fall asleep on his belly"? https://www.standard.co.uk/culture/theatre/my-neighbour-totoro-barbican-royal-shakespeare-company-b1032199.html (AGF)-Bogger (talk) 14:05, 1 December 2022 (UTC)
- I can't say I agree on the hooks. The point of a hook at DYK is to draw the reader in to want to read the article. The
"cryptic"
nature of ALTs 0, 3, and 4 are not bugs, they're features. ALT0's "sore cheeks" is not a colloquialism: if cheeks are sore, they hurt ... Sdrqaz (talk) 17:11, 2 December 2022 (UTC)- Approved, (recommending ALT1) -Bogger (talk) 23:11, 2 December 2022 (UTC)
- Thank you, Sdrqaz (talk) 06:04, 3 December 2022 (UTC)
- While I understand the sentiment behind that, it's more of a case-by-case thing rather than being actively encouraged. Sometimes hooks are just too cryptic that they actually hurt readership rather than help, and I can see those cases being examples of that. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 02:57, 3 December 2022 (UTC)
- Perhaps – DYK hookiness is a little unpredictable. I personally prefer ALT0 and the other "quirky" ones because they feel a lot more interesting (how does it give you sore cheeks?), but it's up to the promoter. Sdrqaz (talk) 06:04, 3 December 2022 (UTC)
- Approved, (recommending ALT1) -Bogger (talk) 23:11, 2 December 2022 (UTC)
- I can't say I agree on the hooks. The point of a hook at DYK is to draw the reader in to want to read the article. The
Casting tables
[edit]Per WP:CRYSTAL, casting tables should not be updated until the production in question officially begins performances. Things can happen between now and the scheduled start of performances. It could be canceled, recast, or delayed. The scheduled start is March 8, 2025. If that happens, the table should then be updated. Smitty1999 (talk) 21:04, 31 January 2025 (UTC)
- @Smitty1999: I don't quite understand the argument you're making here. The "Wikipedia is not a crystal ball" policy prohibits making unsubstantiated speculative statements in articles, it does not prohibit every possible statement about future events. The information you removed is verifiable and supported by a seemingly reliable source, so I don't see why putting it into the article should be objectionable. It's certainly possible that the casting could change between now and the show's opening, but the article can just be edited and the sources updated; the mere chance of it happening should not prevent us from adding that information now. Also, sending out courtesy pings for GoodbyeYellowBrickRoad123 and Sdrqaz, who were editorially involved with the cast section the last few days. —TechnoSquirrel69 (sigh) 00:04, 1 February 2025 (UTC)
- @TechnoSquirrel69 It's the fact that the production has not happened yet. Yes, it has been announced and casting too, but like I mentioned before, it has not yet happened and anything can happen between now and its scheduled start of performances. Whenever it officially starts performances, that is when the casting tables can be updated. Notable performers in the show can be listed in narrative form in the Production history section. There is no rush into updating the cast boards. Just wait until it officially opens. Smitty1999 (talk) 11:09, 1 February 2025 (UTC)
- I think I addressed this in my previous reversion; I won't repeat what TechnoSquirrel said (and what I said in the reversion edit summary). Thanks, Sdrqaz (talk) 02:09, 1 February 2025 (UTC)
- I have brought this dispute up to WP:THEATRE and am waiting to hear back from any editors who have better knowledge on this subject. I will place what user Ssilvers told me in his talk page as to why casting tables should NOT be updated until the production in question officially opens. This is the guidance I have been following on this subject for years now.
- "1. The production could be cancelled. This happened to numerous productions at the beginning of the Covid pandemic, and it routinely happens when producers don't come up with the funds for a production. It can happen for a variety of other reasons, like last-minute damage to the theatre, a stage-hand, actor or orchestra strike, or even bad press/word-of-mouth that causes a production to fizzle even before previews begin. 2. An actor can have an injury or other medical problem shortly before the show opens. This happened in the recent B'way revival of West Side Story and to several actors during rehearsals of Spider-Man: Turn Off the Dark. 3. An actor can be fired or just quit during rehearsals. 4. The source can be mistaken, so it is best not to jump on the first source. 5. Casting is an over-written part of musical theatre articles anyhow, which give cast information often three times -- especially bad are the bloated cast tables that take up far more real estate in an article than they really deserve, and this is made worse by prematurely adding more columns. 6. The production doesn't really "exist" until it at least begins public performances" Smitty1999 (talk) 18:07, 14 February 2025 (UTC)
- Thanks for bringing the discussion here, Smitty1999. I'll also throw out a courtesy ping for Ssilvers since you're apparently quoting them here. While I don't think these concerns are unreasonable by any means, I think many don't really apply to this situation. The production being unexpectedly canceled or experiencing casting changes, like I've said before, shouldn't prevent us from adding information to the article now; after all, things could change even after the show opens. If reliable sources report that a change has occurred, the article can just be updated to reflect it. The table itself doesn't seem particularly bloated to me at the moment, but feel free to bring up any places you think it could be consensed if you feel otherwise. A few of the other concerns are somewhat outside of my area of interest or expertise, like "
The production doesn't really "exist" until it at least begins public performances
" — I think I'll leave that for editors more familiar with theater to sort out. Overall, however, I'm not seeing enough of a reason to completely omit the 2025 production from the article at this stage. —TechnoSquirrel69 (sigh) 04:02, 16 February 2025 (UTC)
- Thanks for bringing the discussion here, Smitty1999. I'll also throw out a courtesy ping for Ssilvers since you're apparently quoting them here. While I don't think these concerns are unreasonable by any means, I think many don't really apply to this situation. The production being unexpectedly canceled or experiencing casting changes, like I've said before, shouldn't prevent us from adding information to the article now; after all, things could change even after the show opens. If reliable sources report that a change has occurred, the article can just be updated to reflect it. The table itself doesn't seem particularly bloated to me at the moment, but feel free to bring up any places you think it could be consensed if you feel otherwise. A few of the other concerns are somewhat outside of my area of interest or expertise, like "
Before a noteworthy production begins, it's planning should be reported in the Productions section: "A production in the West End is planned to begin performances on [date] and to open officially on [date], directed by x, starring y and z." But it is not necessary to *also* add the casting to the cast table, which is a table meant to report the full casts of the original production and major-market revivals. As far as WP:CRYSTAL is concerned, remember that lots of planned productions are cancelled at the last minute (or postponed) when funding falls through, the star is injured, a pandemic closes the theatres, the director and playwright quarrel, or any number of other reasons. So it would be unencyclopedic to give too much emphasis in the article to items that are uncertain to occur. -- Ssilvers (talk) 04:17, 16 February 2025 (UTC)