Talk:Musandam Governorate

Area and Population figures

I have corrected the Area and Population figures (1993 census) . I have elaborated on the administrative divisions. Bharatveer 04:52, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

Old British telegraph relay station

I read somewhere that the Musandam penninsular was the site of an old British telegraph relay station, which was so "off the beaten track", and extremely hot, that people sent there went "Round the bend" or insane, the origin of this term. Any further info would be welcomed, please contact Steve.Owad-Jones@oilsearch.com.au

I don't know whether you are still reading there, but this refers to Telegraph Island a little off the shore. I took a picture which is on commons at [1]. -- Arcimboldo (talk) 04:28, 9 May 2009 (UTC)

Map

The map shows Musandam as an island and not as a peninsula. Can someone please correct the map; I do not know how to do it.--Genossegerd (talk) 13:28, 2 August 2009 (UTC)

I agree with the above comment from 2009 - map is extremely confusing. I had to study a non Wikipedia maps to make sense of the article and realise the lower "island" was exclave totally enclosed within UAE and the upper "island" was an exclave at the tip of the peninsula. Needs an outline of the UAE to make sense. I don't know how to change map either. Tiddy (talk) 06:16, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

I guess all Omani articles are regularly maintained by someone there so just checked map again. Don't understand the reticence to amend map to show adjoining UAE territory. Although "exclave" is used in the main text I still believe most people would find this map very confusing. Tiddy (talk) 02:35, 17 July 2011 (UTC)

Jan 2012 - Again - the map is not enlightening - looks like Musandam is an island. (By the way, its a fantastic place to visit.) My contribution is in regard to the photo, which looks to be the village we saw on our Dhow trip. We were told by Omanis that it was created by people ousted from where they were living, had no water supply until tanks were put in very recently, so relied on passing boats!! How did they survive?? You can see many of the houses look like they grew out of the rock.It still has no road in. Something of this would be good as a caption. Lin Rose — Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.98.208.241 (talk) 01:30, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

I've forwarded a request (for UAE border outlines) to the original creator of the map. Perhaps a request at WP:WikiProject_Maps may be in order as well. -- ToE 04:58, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

Hi, I am sorry for the confusion. I thought at the time that drawing it so would make it better. I guess I was wrong. I will try to Fix the map asap. --Tarawneh (talk) 11:07, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

The map is so much clearer. Thanks. Tiddy (talk) 04:26, 24 June 2012 (UTC)

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Why I separated Musandam Peninsula from Musandam Governorate

Musandam Governorate is mostly the Omani part of the Musandam Peninsula, not the peninsula itself. Part of the peninsula is ruled by the United Arab Emirates. Leo1pard (talk) 09:52, 4 April 2018 (UTC)

References

Why Musandam is part of Oman

@Alexandermcnabb I can't find any sources to support the idea that Musandam was recognised as independent before 1970. The source I cited when changing it states:

After a compromise had been reached in 1850 between Sayyid Sa'id of Muscat and Shaikh Sultan bin Saqr (1803-66), Qäsimi rule was undisputed in the area north of the line connecting Shärjah town on the west coast with Khaur Kalba on the east coast, but excluding the almost inaccessible territory north of Sha'am and Dibah.

— Heard-Bey, Frauke (1982). From Trucial States to United Arab Emirates: a society in transition. London; New York: Longman. p. 82. ISBN 978-0-582-78032-3.

This seems very clear to me that Musandam (the territory north of Sha'am and Dibah) was not ceded in the 1850 agreement.

Further, maps prior to the Intradon operation show Musandam as part of Oman including in 1928, 1962 and 1967. A British report from 1903 states that while it is de-facto independent, the Sultan of Muscat maintains that it is his territory and has a representative in Khasab. In the 1930s Britain signed an agreement with Muscat for air access over Musandam.

It seems clear that from 1850-1970 Musandam was de jure claimed by Oman while de facto ruled locally and I cannot find any sources to the contrary. Peetel (talk) 23:55, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

I think that's precisely my point - the territory was not ceded in 1850, nor was it Muscat's to cede - Heard-Bey makes it clear that Muscat made no dispute of the Qasimi area of rule south of the line between Sharjah and Kalba. But that didn't mean any claim to areas north of that line (which would, incidentally, have included Ajman, Umm Al Quwain, Jazirat Al Hamra and Ras Al Khaimah - all north of Sharjah). The Musandam, or Rus Al Jibal, was independent and not recognised as 'belonging' to Muscat in any sense. "Statements such as 'before, we ruled ourselves', 'we managed our own affairs' described the general situation of the past. British and Arabic documents record the same for northern Oman and Musandam (Walker 1994; vol 5, 526 – 7), where in 1938 Sultan Sa'id explained to the British Consul in Masqat that he was unable to comply with an order to stop the Walis of Shinas and Suhar co-operating with Ras al-Khaimah over security in Wadi al-Qawr, since to do so 'he would be in effect breaking up a time honoured custom … For centuries, the Sultan went on to say, these peoples [in the wider area] had maintained constant intercourse with each other and such problems as grazing and water rights, arrest of fugitive robbers and trade matters had invariably been settled direct by the Shaikhs and Headmen concerned on each side without reference to the Muscat government'. Madha (Walker 1994; vol. 4, 806), Masafi (vol.4, 489), Rams (vol.3, 435), the Khawatir (vol.5, 807) and the Habus (vol.3, 438) were said to have been independent or virtually so in the 1930s and 40s, and for the Habus, up to 1955. Archive information describes similar situations for other areas."

Lancaster's book is an excellent source for this, demonstrating that the Shihhu (and Habus and others) of the area went to whichever Sheikh they thought would suit the circumstance - RAK or Muscat or even other Shayukh. Besides, there was no 'Oman' to claim anything in 1850 - it wasn't until 1951 that the British recognised 'Muscat and Oman' and not until 1970 that full control was established over the interior by Muscat. Best Alexandermcnabb (talk) 05:25, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for your careful and informative response. I acknowledge some issues with what I wrote but still find the current wording to be incomplete. While it is undisputed that the area was effectively ruled by the Sihihhu until 1970 (and I should have this more clear), I can find multiple sources referring to the Sultan's claim in the early 20th century:

[...] the Sultan would doubtless, if asked the direct question, claim jurisdiction over the Maklab Isthmus and the Ras Musandam promontory

— "'File XVII/1 Naval Bases in the Gulf. Correspondence Concerning Above - Report by P.A. Muscat re. Sultan's Boundaries & Limit of Jurisdiction in Northern Oman' [‎43r] (86/96)". 1903.

This excrescence is Musandam. A territory belonging to the Oman Sultanate, it is separated from its suzerain by the Qawasim corridor

— Thomas, Bertram (1929). "The Musandam peninsula and its people the Shihuh". Journal of The Royal Central Asian Society. 16 (1): 71–86. doi:10.1080/03068372908725040. ISSN 0035-8789.

I have tried to rewrite my earlier attempt given your clarifications and additional research. I look forward to your feedback.

== History ==

Isolated from surrounding powers by mountainous terrain and a rocky coast, the Musandam peninsula was historically self-ruled by the local Shihuh tribe. By the early 20th century, Musandam was claimed by the Sultan of Oman who stationed a representative in Khasab. The Sultan did not exert effective control over the area, neither collecting tax nor establishing a military presence, and the peninsula continued to be ruled by the Shihuh. In 1970-71, following the British backed 1970 Omani coup d'état, British and Trucial Oman Scout forces invaded Musandam ending local rule and establishing a permanent Omani military force. Peetel (talk) 01:16, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Hiya. I'd say that was bang on the money! If I were to nitpick 'self-ruled by the Shihuh and other local tribes such as the Habus' but we're good... Thank you! Best Alexandermcnabb (talk) 06:26, 31 October 2024 (UTC)