Talk:Michael Angelis

Early comments

The correct term for someone from Liverpool is Liverpudlian. --Deville (Talk) 05:24, 18 March 2006 (UTC) What was the title of a play/film wher Michael Angelis played the owner of a night club, very funny comedy the same format as Phoenix Nights, anyone who can help??? No Surrender? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.232.173.228 (talk) 09:54, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

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BetacommandBot 04:03, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Years active end date

Wikipedia, A Thomas The Tank Engine Wiki, and Mirror say that his years active ending date was 2012.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Angelis

https://ttte.fandom.com/wiki/Michael_Angelis

https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/breaking-michael-angelis-dead-thomas-22114357

However, IMDB says 2019.

https://m.imdb.com/name/nm0029617/filmotype/actor?ref_=m_nmfm_1

What should this be changed to? MikaelaArsenault (talk) 00:31, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

The 2019 thing was a Thomas compilation. It looks like the last new thing he was in was a 2015 episode of Casualty, so I've changed the end date to 2015. MFlet1 (talk) 07:31, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

Died aged 68 or 76?

It seems there are multiple sources with different claims of the age at which he died. I initially changed the source previously given to a source from The Guardian as it is a more well-known and potentially reputable source than the previous one. Perhaps we should leave out his age until reliable sources form a consensus. Please add to the list below if you find other well-known reliable sources for each claim. Note I have avoided using local newspapers like the Shropshire Star, as it is hard to tell how reliable local news outlets are.

Reliable sources saying 76:

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2020/may/31/michael-angelis-thomas-the-tank-engine-narrator-dies-aged-76

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/05/31/thomas-tank-engine-narratormichael-angelis-dies-suddenly/

Reliable sources saying 68:

https://news.sky.com/story/michael-angelis-thomas-the-tank-engine-narrator-and-auf-wiedersehen-pet-star-dies-11997794

Helper201 (talk) 07:54, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

Mirror also says that he died at 68.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/breaking-michael-angelis-dead-thomas-22114357

MikaelaArsenault (talk) 09:56, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

BBC News say 76: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-52867159

Independent say 68: https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/news/michael-angelis-death-cause-age-thomas-the-tank-engine-liver-birds-a9540771.html

Samuel J Walker (talk) 10:03, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

It looks like January 18, 1952 got removed as well.

MikaelaArsenault (talk) 11:08, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

IMDb said January 18, 1952. I would trust this over an autobiography (Harpo Marx dropped FIVE years in his!) or online newspaper date. I don't know why we are hesitating. Many other Wikipedia entries have more than one date of birth (or year) for a particular person! JohnbRoberts (talk) 21:12, 31 May 2020 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 175.37.90.25 (talk)

IMDb isn’t a reliable source though.

MikaelaArsenault (talk) 12:44, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

I think 76 is more likely to be correct if you look at the birth indexes on Free BMD. His older brother's birth index appears to be: McCulla Paul, mother: McCulla, District: Liverpool South, Quarter: Jan/Feb/Mar 1943 and Michael's appears to be: Angelis Nicolas M, mother: McCulla, District: Paddington, Quarter: Apr/May/Jun 1944.C3MC2 (talk) 12:52, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

Thank you. MikaelaArsenault (talk) 14:38, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

Unless there are no objections, I'm going to install the 1944 date. Between 1943 and 1953 (which covers both reported ages of 68 and 76 at death), there is only one person in the GRO that could be him: Angelis, Nicolas M. If media agencies blindly follow IMDb, that's not our problem and another reason why we shouldn't consider them as the be all and end all of references when the official records give us the correct answer. Thanks --Jkaharper (talk) 12:15, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

I object. Please wait for a consensus. We have no citation for 1944. Regardless there are conflicting ages, thus conflicting birth dates. His birth date seems to either be circa 1952 or 1944 if we work back -68 or -76. But we shouldn't. This is WP:SYNTHESIS. We don't know if some media sources are following IMDb or not. There are multiple reliable sources for both ages, and thus different birth dates are possible. Helper201 (talk) 12:44, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

I see there was an obituary from The Times given for the birth claim of 1944. While this may be correct, what's to say this has more weight than other sources that contradict it like those from The Independent or Sky News? How are we to say which is right and which is wrong? Helper201 (talk) 12:51, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

Companies House is a flawless source. They say he was born in April 1944 https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/officers/Kn6nC8kFZ82bJdx5z4pJEIJEmOM/appointments Ron Stowmarket (talk) 13:56, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

Companies House, though useful, is far from flawless as there is no legal requirement for the person registering to put their real date of birth. For example, Fenella Fielding gave 1936, but she was really 9 years older(!). Although I do think it's obvious the 1944 date is correct in the case of this article. Crisso (talk) 09:45, 2 June 2020 (UTC)

The obituary in the Times today says:

” Nicolas Michael Angelis was born in Paddington, west London, in 1944, the son of Evangelos Angelis, an immigrant from Syros in Greece, and Margaret (née McCulla), who appears to have died when her son was about three. In 1984 her name was the subject of ‘‘Where Are You Now Margaret McCulla?’’, a radio play starring Michael and written by his brother Paul, also an actor who played PC Bruce Bannerman in Z-Cars and voiced Starr in the film Yellow Submarine (1965).[...]

Little else is known about Angelis’s childhood or early twenties, and he would often allow a few years to be lost from his age, with some records suggesting that he was born in 1952. What is certain is that by the late 1960s he was studying at the Royal Scottish Academy of Music and Drama in Glasgow, appearing as Flute in a student production of A Midsummer Night’s Dream in April 1971 and receiving an award for his “performance in a character part”. He was married that year, although the relationship did not last.[...]

Michael Angelis, actor, was born on April 29, 1944. He died of a suspected heart attack on May 30, 2020, aged 76”

This obituary would also imply that we’re missing at least one spouse in the infobox. —Arwel Parry (talk) 16:48, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

I don't know why one can't just reach out to someone that would know his birth information for certain. It's just outrageous, no offence in any way. ― C.Syde (talk | contribs) 00:56, 5 June 2020 (UTC)

His funeral page at A.B. Walker says he was 76. This info was presumably provided to them by his family. Although his obits in The Times, Guardian, The Telegraph, The Herald Scotland, Irish Independent etc should be enough for us to go with. Crisso (talk) 13:28, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

Not born in Liverpool

There's a problem here with the place of birth. Contrary to sources his birth appears to have been in the Paddington registration district in London. The birth index that appears to be the right one for him is Angelis Nicolas M, mother: McCulla, District: Paddington, Quarter: Apr/May/Jun 1944.C3MC2 (talk) 13:11, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

Was he actually born in January though? MikaelaArsenault (talk) 14:38, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

It could have been a late registration. You would have thought a January birth would have resulted in a Jan/Feb/Mar registration but as this was during the war it may have been delayed for some reason. A baptism record could either support or contradict the date of birth. The parents were married in the Jul/Aug/Sep quarter of 1943 in the Paddington registration district, names were Evangelos Angelis and Margaret McCulla, it looks like although they didn't marry in time for the birth of Paul, they were able to marry in time for Michael. The mother died in Surrey SW district in 1947 and the father died in Newton district (Lancashire) in 1959.C3MC2 (talk) 14:58, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

Some further information: Evangelus Angelis is buried at Allerton Cemetery, Liverpool. The address on the burial register entry is 535 Aigburth Road Liverpool. A 1945 Electoral Register has a Margaret Angelis living in a household with two McCulla females at 13 Woodruff Street Toxteth Liverpool. A Margaret McCulla was born in the Toxteth district in 1920 which matches the age at death for the Margaret Angelis who died in 1947.C3MC2 (talk) 15:44, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

Father's first name is recorded as Evangelos in most sources rather than Evangelus or Evangelis.C3MC2 (talk) 16:05, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

It looks like the family background was complicated. There's a 1931 marriage for an Evangelos Angelis to a Marika Sotiropoulou or Sotiropoulos in Liverpool and children born to this marriage. A 1960 Electoral Register reveals that Marika and two of these children were living at 535 Aigburth Road Liverpool the same address that appears on the burial entry for Evangelos Angelis in 1959. Separation from his first wife might explain why they didn't marry straight away in Liverpool and why they moved south.C3MC2 (talk) 16:52, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

According to the Times obituary, his birthday was 29th April 1944 and he was born in Paddington, west London. As this seems to fit in with the GRO records mentioned above, I've added it to the article. MFlet1 (talk) 12:42, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 20 September 2020

Is there by any chance if someone could fix his years active info in the infobox, from "1968–2013" to "1968–2020". Because there is no source in the article that states he retired from acting in 2013, he was still active until his death in 2020. 2600:1000:B002:C683:14FB:2738:E6BE:7A3A (talk) 04:24, 20 September 2020 (UTC)

When the last listed credit is from 2012, I actually will use this over 2013 or 2020 unless somebody provides evidence of working after that year. SNUGGUMS (talk / edits) 18:24, 20 September 2020 (UTC)

We don't need "years active" at all, because we have birth and death dates. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 18:27, 20 September 2020 (UTC)

We don't need years active? What are you talking about? I wasn't asking for it to be deleted, I was asking for it to be correctly fixed. Having it deleted is completely unnessesary, no offense by the way. Years active should always be included at all times, because it talks about the many years that the actor/actress has been active in the show buisness. Not about their births and deaths of years active, I'm just really confused on what your talking about with years active. No offense Pigsonthewing, it's just that your reply about this doesn't make any sense at all. 2600:1000:B033:2B98:94F3:F07E:BD35:DC86 (talk) 18:59, 20 September 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 20 September 2020

Is there by any chance if someone could fix his years active info in the infobox, from "1968–2012" to "1968–2015". Because his last acting credit was in an episode of the television series Casuality in 2015 accourding to his Filmography. This has to be fixed right away, because's its currently wrong. 2600:1000:B033:2B98:94F3:F07E:BD35:DC86 (talk) 18:51, 20 September 2020 (UTC)

Done. Nikkimaria (talk) 00:12, 21 September 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 June 2023

Hi. I was just wondering if it is possible to mention that Peirce Brosnan was originally supposed to take over from Michael as the Thomas narrator in 2008. Joewiki1997 (talk) 04:12, 17 June 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Cannolis (talk) 04:29, 17 June 2023 (UTC)