Talk:Mephistopheles and Margaretta

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by SL93 (talk) 01:29, 8 March 2022 (UTC)

(

• Comment or view
• Article history

)

Wooden sculpture of Mephistopheles & Margaretta in front of a mirror

• ... that the Mephistopheles & Margaretta sculpture (pictured) is best seen with a mirror behind it? Source: The sculpture's theatrical scene truly unfolds when a mirror sits behind the male figure (which would mean it's in front of the female figure), making it appear as though the woman is standing behind the man.
  • ALT1: ... that the Mephistopheles & Margaretta sculpture (pictured) tells the story of Faust with carvings in one block of wood? Source: This incredible double sculpture is a retelling of Faust through one piece of wood. On one side, you have a man standing arrogantly; on the other, there's a demure woman with her head bowed slightly.
  • ALT2: ... that Mephistopheles & Margaretta (pictured) is a "double sculpture" representing good and evil? Source: sculpture is a metaphor for good and evil
  • Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Arthur Dudley Dobson memorial ‎

Created by Bruxton (talk). Self-nominated at 02:40, 11 February 2022 (UTC).

• new enough, long enough, well-written and well-sourced. First hook is very good. QPQ done. Shahid • ^Talk2me 15:41, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

This review is transcluded from Talk:Mephistopheles and Margaretta/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Golden (talk · contribs) 23:42, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

I had to fail this nomination because the article was "a long way from meeting any one of the six good article criteria", especially criteria 1 and 3. However, I think this article has potential to reach GA status in the future, with some more work. Please don't lose heart! I enjoyed reading this article and learning about this fascinating sculpture and its history. I had already completed most of the review before I made my decision, so I'll leave those suggestions for you in case you want to renominate this article.

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)
It is reasonably well written. a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists): It is factually accurate and verifiable. a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism): It is broad in its coverage. a (major aspects): b (focused): It follows the neutral point of view policy. Fair representation without bias: It is stable. No edit wars, etc.: It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate. a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
Overall: Pass/Fail:
· · ·

Lead and infobox

• I doubt anyone will know what a "double sculpture" (why is it in quotes?), so it would be useful to give a short description of it. Maybe something like Mephistopheles and Margaretta is a 19th-century wooden double sculpture, featuring two images carved on opposite sides, that portrays two characters from Johann Wolfgang von Goethe's 1808 play Faust.
• Briefly introduce Goethe in the lead.
• A mirror placed behind the sculpture allows both sides to be seen simultaneously. - If we explain what a double sculpture is in the first sentence, this sentence would be redundant.
• The source cited for the completion date in the infobox doesn't mention the sculpture being completed on that date. Instead, it states that Mir Turab Ali Khan acquired it on that date.
• The lead should be longer than two sentences (last one being removed if point 2 is followed). You could expand it by writing about the sculpture's meaning and creation history.

Background

• Wikilink Goethe and Faust in the first sentence.
• Briefly introduce Goethe in the the first sentence.
• Faust is frustrated with his life and attempts suicide. He calls for Satan's help - Clarify whether he called for help during or after his attempted suicide.
• and as one of his requests for magic - Do you mean wishes when you mention requests for magic? Could you briefly give information about these wishes before Faust makes one, so the reader isn't caught off guard?
• his bastard son. - Why was he considered a "bastard"?
• Gretchen realizes the evil in the situation - Could you clarify the meaning of this sentence? Did Gretchen realise that Faust made a deal with the Devil or that his son was a "bastard"? In any case, situation may not be the most appropriate word to use here.
• Gretchen realizes the evil in the situation and drowns the child, and is held in jail on the charge of murder. Gretchen is hanged but is allowed to go to heaven - This is optional, but to avoid two consecutive "and"s and two consecutive sentences starting with "Gretchen", this sentence could be rewritten for better flow: "Upon realizing the evil in the situation, Gretchen drowns her child and is subsequently imprisoned on charges of murder. She is ultimately hanged, but is granted entry into heaven."
• I don't see the relevance of Marlowe and Bulgakov's novels to this sculpture, particularly Bulgakov's, which was written at least 50 years after the sculpture's creation.

Sculpture

• on his long face. - What is a long face?
• The reverse is of Gretchen with -> "On the reverse side, Gretchen is depicted with"
• simple girl - What is this supposed to mean?
• one single block -> "a single block"
• and the base material is sycamore wood. - Repetition
• the dimensions of the statue is 177.2 cm - 177.2cm what? Length or width? Both should be indicated. Also, it should be "the dimensions of the statue are".
• it has been presumably been created -> "it was presumably created"
• The sculpture represents the thin line that exists between the binary between good and evil as represented by Margaretta and Mephistopheles, respectively. The male image stands proud in a hooded cloak, heeled boots and has a long, gaunt face with a cynical smile, while Margaretta is shown as a shy, simple girl with a prayer book in her hand, and downcast eyes, lost in love. - This entire paragraph repeats information that was already mentioned in almost the same words in previous paragraphs.
• Briefly introduce Mir Turab Ali Khan, Salar Jung II.
• Remove comma after "Salar Jung II".
• I recommend shortening his name to "Salar Jung I".
• Remove comma after "1876".
• perhaps remains one of the most photographed images of the museum - Before mentioning this, the reader should be informed of the statue's location.
• The museum is one of the most visited in the country, and claims one million visitors annually. - Irrelevant.
• Remove one of the images (they are practically the same anyway) to avoid MOS:SANDWICHING.
• superb - Remove per MOS:PEACOCK.
• I did not review the rest of the last paragraph.

Criteria 1

• As mentioned above, the article has several issues with MOS and grammar.

Criteria 2

• There was at least one instance of original research in the article. After deciding to fail the nomination, I didn't check other sources.
• Earwig's copyvio detector has identified several issues with two sources: hydnews.net and theheritagelab.in

Criteria 3

• The article is very short and could be greatly expanded with new sources. There's no shortage of material about the sculpture.
• As noted above, the article contains several sentences that are irrelevant to the subject.

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.