Talk:Mauro Forghieri
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"transversal automatic gear"
[edit]In the lead section and nowhere else, there is a mention of Forghieri designing the "first transversal automatic gear, also known as T gear." I can't find any reference to this in any online sources, nor do I quite understand what the terminology means, despite being fairly familiar with the technology of Forghieri's era. Maybe a transverse automatic transmission? Hoping someone else can shed light on it so it can be properly cited and/or reworded if needed. Prova MO (talk) 19:05, 7 March 2020 (UTC)
- The gearbox used in the 312T series of Forghieri-designed Formula 1 cars was a manual transmission. The “transversal” refers to the gearbox shafts being across the car i.e. at 90 degrees to the crankshaft, to keep the mass of the gearbox ahead of the rear axle. It was pensioned off along with the 3-litre flat-12 engine when Ferrari switched to a turbocharged V6 in 1981. No idea where the “automatic” notion comes from, coz it certainly wasn’t one. I'm sure there's a fair few Ferrari histories that would have chapter and verse or – failing that – there’s always the Haynes Manual :-) https://haynes.com/en-gb/ferrari-312t-owners-workshop-manual Mr Larrington (talk) 01:15, 30 April 2022 (UTC)
- I agree that the transmissions of the 312T series were definitely manual. I guess it's possible that Forghieri designed the first transversal automatic gear(box), separate from his F1 activities, e.g. for a road car project. Interestingly, while researching the topic, I found this article, which states that Forghieri fitted a prototype semi-automatic transmission to a 1979 Ferrari 312T, which is something I'd never read before. DH85868993 (talk) 11:51, 30 April 2022 (UTC)
Given Forghieri's recent passing, addressing this seems more urgent. I've already reverted a presumed case of WP:CITOGENESIS where a non-specialist publication reprinted the bit about "first transversal automatic gear, also known as T gear" and someone used it to cite the statement in this article. I'm going to get a copy of the 312T Haynes manual and check some other sources (including the Ferrari magazine article linked by DH85868993) in order to clarify this. Thanks for the input folks and let me know if there are any additional sources I should check. Prova MO (talk)
- After reviewing the 312T Haynes manual, the article "Great Ferrari Innovations: The F1 semi-automatic gearbox" and several other sources including Forghieri's autobiography "Forghieri on Ferrari", I feel I have enough info to make some edits about this topic. Basically, Forghieri seems to have developed a prototype semi-automatic version of the 312T's transverse gearbox in 1979. This was not a fully automatic transmission, but rather a modified version of the manual transmission that was semi-automated by a hydraulic system. This predates the use of a similar system in Ferrari F1 cars starting in 1989 and also the "F1" automated manual gearbox used in Ferrari road cars. I cannot find any reliable sources that support the claim that it is the first system of this kind, nor do I find the "T gear" name in use anywhere. So I'm going to revise the article to clarify that it is a semi-automatic/automated manual system, remove the claim of it being the first, and remove the "T gear" name. While this may very well be the first system of its type, the statement currently stands unsupported and is likely WP:SYN. Prova MO (talk) 18:27, 18 December 2022 (UTC)