Talk:Marine ecosystem

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Overlap with marine habitat article?

It seems to me that the section called "Coastal ecosystems" repeats a lot of the same content that can also be found at the marine habitat article, e.g. for kelp forests or coral reefs. I am just wondering if this is intended and unavoidable or if it wasn't intended in the original design of the articles. If we feel that the same content ought to be in two articles, perhaps it would be useful to work more with the excerpt function? The advantage there is that the content only has to be maintained and updated in one place, not in two. I have used the excerpt function a lot for aquatic ecosystem for example. Also, maybe the marine ecosystem article should focus more on processes and aspects that are common to all marine ecosystems, rather than trying to explain all the different "types" of marine ecosystems with a separate section for each one? Compare a bit with the ecosystem article, which does not try to list and detail all the different ecosystems that can be found on earth. EMsmile (talk) 13:46, 9 August 2021 (UTC)

Content of this article? Rename to "Coastal marine ecosystem" or expand?

In the section on "deep sea and ocean floor" there were these sub-headings but they were empty so I removed them:

• Open pelagic ocean
• Seamounts
• Seeps and vents

I spoke with a content expert about this article (Ivan Nagelkerken) and his suggestion is this: "I suggest to rename that page to 'Coastal marine ecosystems' In contrast, 'Marine habitats' covers all ocean habitats (i.e. also deep ocean, open ocean, etc.) but because it includes the nearshore ocean, it has partial overlap with Coasts and with Marine Ecosystems." The way the article is currently written, it is mainly just about coastal ecosystems (except for the section on threats). EMsmile (talk) 02:42, 17 August 2021 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Oceanography

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 10 January 2022 and 6 May 2022. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Nadyagutierrez (article contribs).

Suitable hatnote to distinguish from marine habitat?

Can we think of a suitable hatnote to make it clear to readers how this article differs from marine habitat? See also my comment above about the current overlap in the area of coastal systems. Pinging User:Epipelagic, User:Vsmith and User:ASRASR. That section on threats would be quite similar (the same?) for marine ecosystem, marine habitat, marine biology etc. Might be better to bundle it in one location and then to refer across from other articles. EMsmile (talk) 21:40, 26 May 2022 (UTC)

Hi User:InformationToKnowledge, what's your take on this? You mentioned somewhere that you wanted to merge marine habitat and marine ecosystem but I see you haven't formally made the proposal yet? I would be supportive of it. EMsmile (talk) 19:54, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

Well, the evidence from pageviews alone is quite clear that the information in the habitat page would be seen more widely if it were to be merged here.

At the same time, these two pages and the related ones - i.e. marine coastal ecosystem, or aquatic ecosystem or the main habitat page - tend to overlap in ways which would make merging and moving the content around rather complicated, so I have not formally done it yet. InformationToKnowledge (talk) 10:32, 17 December 2023 (UTC)

But in the meantime, I think it would be useful to add a hatnote, don't you think? I've now added this hatnote at marine habitat: This article is about a specific type of environment within the marine ecosystem. For the broader concept with all interactions and characteristics of the marine environment, see marine ecosystem.. I think we should think of marine habitat being a sub-article to marine ecosystem. I've put this question also to Chat-GPT and here is what it came back with: "In summary, a marine habitat refers to a specific type of environment within the marine ecosystem where certain organisms are adapted to live, while a marine ecosystem encompasses the entire system, including all living organisms and their interactions, along with the physical and chemical characteristics of the marine environment. The habitat is a component of the ecosystem." Would you say that is correct? EMsmile (talk) 11:14, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

And I've also added a hatnote to this article now: This article is about the entire ecosystem in saline water, including all living organisms and their interactions. For more detailed aspects about specific types of environment within the marine ecosystem, see marine habitat.. This likely needs further tweaking. Also, Step 2 would be (if we don't merge) to reduce overlap, e.g. repetition in the content about mangroves or kelp forests. EMsmile (talk) 11:20, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: BSC 4052 Conservation Biology

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 16 January 2023 and 28 April 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): VCH100201 (article contribs). Peer reviewers: Sofiahunt.

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Merging Large marine ecosystem into this article

I propose this merge because Large marine ecosystem is neither a large article, nor particularly visible or high-quality. It provides a good description of NOAA's classification system, and the list of LMEs around the world, but I think more people would benefit from seeing those in this article, as it remains small enough to fit them without much issue. Same goes for its paragraphs on "Modules of Ecosystem Condition", which are all general enough to be added here without much issue. (Though the somewhat clunky writing will likely need reworking to fit in here). InformationToKnowledge (talk) 13:18, 16 July 2023 (UTC)

Support as per nominator's reasoning. EMsmile (talk) 08:11, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

Merge completed. There are still issues from the merged article like dated referencing, but I am not sure how much clean-up is warranted for this article when marine habitats seems like the more widely used one? I see you have already brought up this point two years earlier. The two overlap so much with each other and several related articles, and it's getting hard to tell where the scope of one should end, and another begin. Still, it's a start. InformationToKnowledge (talk) 13:35, 31 July 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for doing the merge. Yes, that question about how to delineate this from marine habitat, even just with a suitable hatnote, is still unresolved. I'll try again by pinging the same 3 people whom I have pinged before: User:Epipelagic, User:Vsmith and User:ASRASR: What's your opinion on this? Note also the comment above where it was said this article could be refocused to cover just "marine coastal ecosystems". EMsmile (talk) 07:33, 1 August 2023 (UTC)

Oh, I had forgotten that we already have an article on Marine coastal ecosystem. That means the section on "marine coastal ecosystems" needs to be drastically shortened here. EMsmile (talk) 07:36, 1 August 2023 (UTC)

It seems that User:Epipelagic has retired last week. What a pity! If you still read this: thank you for all your contributions on Wikipedia!! You will be missed (any chance you could come back?) :-( EMsmile (talk) 07:41, 1 August 2023 (UTC)

Further reading list removed

I've removed the further reading list. If any of these are very important they should rather be used for in-line citations.

• Barange M, Field JG, Harris RP, Eileen E, Hofmann EE, Perry RI and Werner F (2010) Marine Ecosystems and Global Change Oxford University Press. ISBN 978-0-19-955802-5
• Davenport J (2008) Challenges to Marine Ecosystems: Proceedings of the 41st European Marine Biology Symposium Volume 202 of Developments in hydrobiology. ISBN 978-1-4020-8807-0
• Levner E, Linkov I and Proth J (2005) Strategic management of marine ecosystems Springer. Volume 50 of NATO Science Series IV. ISBN 978-1-4020-3158-8
• Mann KH and Lazier JRN (2006) Dynamics of marine ecosystems: biological-physical interactions in the oceans Wiley-Blackwell. ISBN 978-1-4051-1118-8 EMsmile (talk) 07:22, 1 August 2023 (UTC)