Talk:Ludwig van Beethoven/Archive 9

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Archive 9

Article class

I don't understand why this is only a class B article. The writing is good and there are a lot of sources. There are many articles about composers which are also class B and not nearly as good as this.

Is there something I'm missing? If not, I think we should vote for a reevaluation to have the article graded A, GA, or even featured. Cheers. Wikieditor662 (talk) 02:25, 13 July 2024 (UTC)

Only certain WikiProjects have an A-class process, and as far as I know none of the relevant ones here do. GA and FA are not votes; GA status requires evaluation by a single reviewer against the GA criteria, whereas FA status requires a candidacy process involving multiple reviewers considering the FA criteria. In both cases nomination should be done by or with the agreement of the most significant contributors to the article. Nikkimaria (talk) 02:37, 13 July 2024 (UTC)

Well the nomination would require someone who significantly contributed to this article and who is available to respond in a timely fashion for the next couple months, neither of which describes me. Do you know anyone who could do this? Wikieditor662 (talk) 02:50, 13 July 2024 (UTC)

New sandbox

Thank you everyone for your help with finding citations for Beethoven. I have created User:Wikieditor662/Beethoven sandbox and started adding notes on there. Please remember that it's not finished. You're all free to add stuff on there too. Here are the notes the other members suggested:

- Get only the most reliable evidence, notably books written by musicologists such as taruskin - There are other good sources, such as Grove, JSTOR, and other archives like https://archive.org/search?query=Beethoven+reception (look at the above comments for other things. You guys posted a lot of useful information). Wikieditor662 (talk) 01:29, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Other good resources I've been told are https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Resource_Exchange/Resource_Request by ColinFine, google books, https://archive.org/details/texts?tab=collection , https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/?next_url=/users/my_library/ , and https://www.jstor.org/stable/746794 (the value of Beethoven). You can find more info on these at #Trouble_finding_reliable_sources in Wikipedia:Reference desk/Humanities

Also, any feedback on the sandbox is greatly appreciated. Thank you! Wikieditor662 (talk) 11:40, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

This would be helpful to you, if you do not have access to Grove/Oxford: https://archive.org/details/cambridgecompani0000unse_f9p8/page/272/mode/2up MONTENSEM (talk) 20:00, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

(The surrounding chapters would also be helpful.) MONTENSEM (talk) 20:23, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

As for the archive, I sadly haven't found anything useful enough to add in the two pages that I could see. Doing more would require you to create an account with your email which I am not willing to do, so if there's anything useful there, perhaps you could add it to https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/User:Wikieditor662/Beethoven_sandbox. Wikieditor662 (talk) 20:38, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

It's worth creating an account for utility you'll enjoy. You can read more about it at Internet Archive. MONTENSEM (talk) 23:51, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Also, as a rule, beware of relying on Norman Lebrecht among other journalists and writers, not because they're necessarily bad or wrong (let us bracket that question), but because their will generally be more liable to contest by scholars working in an academic context. MONTENSEM (talk) 20:10, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for your feedback and the archive link.

Hopefully mentioning that the quote is by Lebrecht shows the reader that it's just his opinion on the matter. Let me know if you think it should be removed, but I would argue that we should show some different opinions on Beethoven -- especially from those who are involved in the subject. Wikieditor662 (talk) 20:24, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

It's great to have different opinions. This might be a good resource, too, in relation to Beethoven and US pop music: https://archive.org/details/beethoveninameri0000broy/page/292/mode/2up MONTENSEM (talk) 23:59, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you once again very much. I added some of the information I saw on here to the article (as well as a portrait, which I'm not sure is okay since the same one is used in the Romantic music article).

Please send me any other useful information you find. I hope that once the sandbox is ready there won't be heavy resistance when it comes to adding it to Beethoven's legacy section -- so far there have been no objections, so I assume that people are okay with what I have written up until this point. Wikieditor662 (talk) 01:31, 4 August 2024 (UTC)