Talk:List of career achievements by Wayne Gretzky

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This was a great idea to lighten the Wayne Gretzky article, but the Records stuff from that article are still there.

I suggest expanding this article, with anything about records from the main Gretzky article, and cutting it from the main article. Also, we should consider moving his career stats to this page too. --MJR 19:52, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)

ideas

I have thought about moving the Gretzky's stats to this page, but i realised that for all other NHL players, their stats are on their main page. By taking Gretzky's stats off the Wayne Gretzky page, it wouldn't be consistant with the rest of wikipedia. Also, my intention with this page was to list records, official and unofficial. Even though most of his stats are in fact records, they are not a list of records. I wanted the gretzky page to be a write up of his highlights and acheivements while the list of records is just that. a list of records.

as for the gretzky's records still on the gretzky page...I think it is important to summarise his records on the main page with the most impressive (or important) records. That summary could be shortened, though. As for the 'amazing stats and facts' section, that should be left on the main page because it isn't a list of records.

One other thing. i have been planning, but haven't started yet, to make a list of all of his 'milestone' records and putting it onto this page.

Let me know some more of your thoughts and together we can make the best page possible.

Masterhatch

I think that his career stats block should also have a WHA totals line and an overall totals line, just to show of more big numbers, which is the point of this pagew. WHPratt (talk) 01:43, 3 May 2012 (UTC)

Still could benefit from a Pro Totals line. WHPratt (talk) 00:58, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

61 records, actually

While he retired with Most career All-Star Game assists (12) as a record, since then Bourque has gotten to 13, and Messier got to 14.

So while he may have edged past Lemieux for career points per game, he really 'only' has 61 records, even if one of them is new.--MJR 14:35, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)

• thank you for that piece of information. i was unaware of that. I did a little net search and i found that he also lost the record for most over time assists in the regular season. As of right now, i am having trouble finding out WHO broke the assists record. I guess now he 'only' has 60...

I found the 'lost' record here: http://www.phoenixcoyotes.com/team/Gretzky_Career_Records.php Masterhatch

Three people are now ahead of Gretzky in career OT Assists. 18-Mark Messier 17-Adam Oates 16-Nicklas Lidstrom --MJR 17:26, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)

• I am impressed. Thank you. Where and how did you find those stats so fast? Google keeps sending me to 'out-dated' gretzky sites.

Masterhatch

Is something wrong with this?

1. Most goals: 894 in 1,485 games
2. Most goals, including playoffs: 1,016 in 1,962 regular season and 260 playoff games

How is it that when playoffs are included Gretzky scored 122 more goals and played 477 more games in the regular season? According to the page about wayne gretzky it says he played in 1487 regular season NHL games and 1694 games with seasons in minor leagues included, scoring a total of 1073 goals in the NHL and minor leagues in the regular season. He had 208 NHL playoff goals and 258 playoff goals with the minor leagues included. One of the two pages is wrong, someone who knows should change one of them. William conway bcc 21:10, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

Fixed it.  RasputinAXP  c 21:28, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

Greztky lost the unofficial "youngest to score 50" record when Alexander Ovechkin did it in 05-06. unsigned comment by 70.55.146.103 (talk · contribs)

Incorrect. Gretzky was 19 years, 2 months and one week (April 2, 1980). Ovechkin was 20 years, 6 months and 27 days old.  RasputinAXP  c 12:34, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

Image nominated for deletion

This image, used in this article has been nominated for deletion. Ed Fitzgerald (unfutz) ^{(talk / cont)} 00:46, 29 August 2008 (UTC)

Gretzky's Unofficial Records

Gretzky was not the fastest player in NHL History to score 200 goals, that record is held by Cy Denneny (who played from 1917-18 until the late 20's)

(more) Gretzky's Unofficial Records

Fastest & Youngest 2050 Points (882 games), (29 years, 341 days) Is there a reason 2050 was added in, where every other milestone was in 100 increments? SquashEngineer (talk) 19:00, 14 November 2022 (UTC)

I looked through the edit history of this article. It looks like back in December of 2015 an IP added that line. I looked further back and realised ten years ago, it didn't have it in every 100 increments, it simply said he's the only player to score 2000 points. I think we should go back to that. I mean, do we really need 2100, 2200, 2300, etc when there is no one else? Masterhatch (talk) 20:06, 14 November 2022 (UTC)

Overtime assists -- 13? 15?

The article states that Gretzky scored 15 career regular-season assists but NHL.com has 13. Also, the number of players who have passed him appears to be many. Is there any source for 15 career regular-season assists? Sxg169 (talk) 16:38, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

Doesn't look like it, changing to 13 Dialmayo (talk) (Contribs) she/her 07:12, 7 January 2024 (UTC)

Gretzky's assist record

To all the IPs out there, this is not a list of current NHL records. It is a list of Gretzky's records at his retirement. And 31 was a record he set and at his retirement, it was a record he held. Once the playoffs are over, we'll go to the update section and make a not there BUT in the list of playoff records, it will still show 15 records and 31 assists. Thank you. Masterhatch (talk) 10:56, 16 June 2024 (UTC)

And notice in the lead it says "As of the start of the 2023–24 season..." So, once this season is over, it will be all updated. Masterhatch (talk) 10:59, 16 June 2024 (UTC)

Actual number of official NHL records

As the name would indicate it, the only authoritative source for what constitutes an official NHL record is the NHL itself. According to their own record book, which is available online, Gretzky hold sole or joint-possession of 62 NHL records. The fact that independent, non-affiliated media mistakenly have listed the total as 61 for many years does not constitute a statue of limitations for correcting the record. Cross-checking the records listed here with the ones in the record book shows that one is missing. It is not "original research" to rely on the official record book.

Unless the sources say 62, you can't change it cuz that's original research. Masterhatch (talk) 20:09, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

I brought this up at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Ice Hockey. Masterhatch (talk) 20:17, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

• User:TheCelebrinator, please revert your edits. The WP:ONUS is on you to get consensus for such a change. Until you get consensus, the article must follow the sources and say 61 records. Thank you! Masterhatch (talk) 20:29, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

I've reverted the changes. Please come up with reliable sources for the record count change. And please don't do that stike out thing — it's gaudy. Masterhatch (talk) 21:20, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

• Ok, so after a quick Google search, I come up with: Hockeywriters 61, Sporting news 61, Sports keeda 61, KTVZ 61, and from NHL dot com itself, 61. So, please don't change it to 62. Masterhatch (talk) 21:48, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

  It's not the correct figure. The figure refers to the number of officially recognized Gretzky records in the NHL record book, which is a more authoritative source than any sports column, including those written for NHL.com which a) only reflect the author's opinions and b) does not act as a substitute for what constitutes a league-recognized official record.

  Cross-checking all the records listed in the official record book with the ones listed in the article shows that there are almost all there, except for the one I wanted to add. It's right here [1]. Note that the "Unofficial records" section of the article specifically refers to records not recognized in the NHL Official Guide and Record Book, therefore implicitly recognizing "Official records" as those which are listed there. TheCelebrinator (talk) 22:47, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

Adding retroactive records

As we've touched on this previously, the NHL Record Book has evolved quite a bit and many new records appear to have been recognized that weren't before, including for Wayne Gretzky. As Ravenswing stated, it appears the 1999 NHL Record Book does indeed credit Gretzky with 61 records as per the standards of the time. I feel like the article should make it clear that's where the 61 records figure comes from, as I myself was wondering. Therefore, something like "according to the 1999 NHL Record Book" could be added.

For the "new" records, I propose to add a section detailing records that are now retroactively recognized. Many of those records are not even mentioned in the article, including virtually every multi-goal/assist/point records, many of which Gretzky holds, despite constituting impressive career achievements.

I would like to hear everyone else's input. @Masterhatch @Ravenswing @Isaacl @Conyo14 TheCelebrinator (talk) 18:47, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

I think we need the record that was retroactively given However, I would say that the wording according to the 1999 record book is slightly too specific. It would be preferable, in my opinion, to say "at the time of his retirement, with some retroactive records being given after his retirement, such as examples. Conyo14 (talk) 19:24, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

The current sentence in the lead is Upon his retirement on April 18, 1999, he was credited by the NHL Record Book with holding or sharing 61 NHL records, including 40 regular season, 15 playoff and 6 All-Star records. I think that's accurate and think the only addition needed is a citation to the 1999 record book. (If someone else could verify it, so there would be at least two people who have looked at it, that would great.) The "Record updates" section currently says The NHL Record Book has also changed to recognize many more of Gretzky's records. which I also think is suitable, though I suggest copy editing it to "The current NHL Record Book also recognizes additional records held by Gretzky."

The sentence in the lead paragraph starting with "As of today..." is the more tricky one. Perhaps something like "As of today, ... he holds or shares 57 of the 61 records from 1999, plus an additional X records that have been recognized since then." isaacl (talk) 21:12, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

I agree with your proposed sentence change for the updated records. For the record, I went ahead and did a deep dive into every regular-season record there is in the Official Record Book and noted the ones where Gretzky either owned or shared the record. By my count, there are 52 such records that qualify, so excluding the records Gretzky held but have since been broken, that's at least 12 other records we could include. Here are the ones I found:

Records held by Wayne Gretzky as of August 2024

Longest assist streak, from start of season: 12 (Tied with Tim Linseman and Sebastian Aho) Latest goal, regulation period, NHL history: 0:01 seconds (A bit of a bogus 'record,' more a feat than anything so I wouldn't quite include it imo) Most 2-point games, season: 62 Most 3-point games, season: 40 Most 5-point games, season: 15 Most multi-point games, career: 824 Most 3-goal games, season: 10 Most multi-goal games, career: 189 Most 2-assist games, career: 44 Most 3-assist games, career: 27 Most 4-assist games, career: 12 Most 5-assist games, career: 4 Most multi-assist games, career: 575

TheCelebrinator (talk) 22:52, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

I added "of those" to the lead because there are retroactive records that have been added. If anyone thinks "of those" doesn't fit, please feel free to revert. Masterhatch (talk) 21:30, 2 September 2024 (UTC)

Ummm... my comment is inside the table. How do I get it out? Masterhatch (talk) 21:38, 2 September 2024 (UTC)

Getting the "61" right

So I looked through the current list of 61, and I noticed his most assists for a 1st year player (7) wasn't on the list. That is why I had asked User:Ravenswing if it was in his book of records from '99. He confirmed it was. I then looked back to see if it was in the original list from nearly 20 years ago — it was. So, I looked up and down the list and realised it was his short handed goal record that was added. I suggest we put his first year record back in to the list of 40 and move the 73 shorties to the retro active section. Then i guess we need a note somehow explaining that that record is no longer his. Thoughts? Masterhatch (talk) 22:11, 2 September 2024 (UTC)

I'd feel more comfortable if someone would list out the 61 records from the source or directly cross-check the article's list against the source, and wouldn't you know it—I do have the 2000 NHL Official Guide and Record Book with a special salute to Gretzky, so if no one else does it first, I can do it later (I had vaguely recalled purchasing it specifically due to Gretzky's retirement). Spoiler: there are 40 regular-season records, 15 playoff records, and 6 All-Star game records (I didn't go through the last category in the current record book, so my tabulation on the ice hockey WikiProject talk page is short). isaacl (talk) 23:56, 2 September 2024 (UTC)

The NHL no longer officially lists Gretzky as the record holder for the most assists in a single game by a rookie (at least, not according to their Record Book website). It might be the NHL just being inconsistent on whether or not Gretzky was actually a rookie back in 1979-80 but if it does actually represent a change in the official records, how do we incorporate a record that wasn't broken per se, but is simply no longer recognized as valid? TheCelebrinator (talk) 07:05, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

I've been thinking about that too. My idea was to include it in the original 61 but in the retro records, make note (somehow) that it's no longer a record. I wasn't sure how to do it so I was in no rush to deal with it Masterhatch (talk) 08:03, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

I've compared the records from the 2000 NHL Official Guide and Record Book with the list in this article:

• As noted, most shorthanded goals (career) is not in the 2000 record book.
• Most overtime assists, career is listed as 15 in the 2000 record book. Gretzky is credited with 13 in the online record book.
• As noted, most assists, one game, by a player in his first NHL season is present in the 2000 record book but not in this article.

So there are no other additions or deletions from the list of records as shown in the 2000 record book. I don't know if the change in overtime assists was a typo in 2000 (the online record book shows Gretzky with 15 overtime points), a reclassification of assists later on, or something else. isaacl (talk) 01:14, 26 September 2024 (UTC)

I'd be in favour of re-adding (it was in there when I created the article in 2005) the most assists by a first year player into the list of 61 and then taking out the one that wasn't mentioned in '99 and putting it in a different spot. Masterhatch (talk) 02:55, 26 September 2024 (UTC)