Talk:List of Bulgarian inventors and discoverers

Petrov

[that Petrov invented the digital watch]

Actually, this is a myth that started after Peter Petroff's death, through the obituary, released by his family. Unfortunately, he had nothing to do with the invention of the first digital watch, namely the "Pulsar" as it is erroneously published in many online sources. Peter Petroff was placed in the CEO position of the merger between the founded by him Care, Inc. and Electro/Data, Inc. which was involved with the development of the Pulsar prototype. Peter Petroff spent only around seven months as a CEO of Electro/Data, Inc., after which he was disposed off due to the accumulation of large debts for the company, after which he went back to being the CEO of Care, Inc. The development of the Pulsar digital watch was started about two years before Peter Petroff got on board Electro/Data, Inc. and was finished and released for sale approximately one year after he was discharged from the company. The real contributors to the invention of the first digital watch were George H. Thiess (founder of Electro/Data, Inc.) and Willie Crabtree who was the Project Engineer at Electro/Data, Inc. and spent four years in the development of the Pulsar digital watch prototype. -- User:208.168.237.85

(User:208.168.237.85 contributed the above comment to the article on 2013-11-03T21:07:06‎; I have moved it to Talk, which is where it belongs. --Macrakis (talk) 03:30, 4 November 2013 (UTC))

John Vincent Atanasoff, invented the first electronic digital computer.

So apparently Atanasoff being "only" of half Bulgarian heritage makes him "ineligible" for "The list comprises people from Bulgaria and also people of predominantly Bulgarian heritage."?

Which is ironic given :

• Carl Djerassi is on the list, who is of Jewish-Austrian-Bulgarian ancestry, effectively making him of no more "predominantly Bulgarian heritage" than Atanasoff.
• Elias Canetti who is also of jewish (and possibly spanish) ancestry is also on the list

Both of whom haven't spent much time of their lives in Bulgaria.

• Djerassi has spent 1 year + unspecified number of summers in Bulgaria, with only attending the ACS for that year where he learned English.
• Canetti has spent barely 6 years since his birth before his family moved to England, with barely or none at all education.

I'm not disputing their Bulgarian heritage, nor their presence on the Wikipedia page, but I'm rather wondering what's the definition of "predominantly Bulgarian heritage" exactly, if it's seemingly neither ethnicity, time spent and education.

And why then Atanasoff shouldn't be there, given he has comparably equal, if not more significant Bulgarian ethnic heritage, has self-identified and honored his Bulgarian ancestry and heritage. You can easily find proof on his Wikipedia page, as well in citation from his letters and various interviews.

"Heritage

Atanasov visited Bulgaria twice, in 1975 and 1985. He visited Boyadzik village, where his grandfather was shot by the Turks and was warmly welcomed by the :locals and his father's relatives. He was made an honorable citizen of the town of Yambol, and received the "Key of the Town". He was also given various titles :by the Bulgarian Academy of Sciences. The John Atanasov prize is awarded every year in Bulgaria. The 3546 Atanasoff asteroid found at the Bulgarian astronomic :observatory of Rozen, was named after him.[8]"

https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/John_Vincent_Atanasoff#Heritage

"Devoting this version of my memoirs to the people of my fatherland, I feel great excitement. I need to tell my Bulgarian readers too many things but words do :not come easily.

My father was born on January 6, 1876, at the time of the preparation of our people for an uprising against the Turks. Before the outbreak of the uprising, the :Turkish governors forced the people of the village of Boyadjik (present Boyadjik, Yambol Region) to leave their houses and then they burnt them. As my :grandfather ran with his son in his hands, followed by my grandmother, a group of Turkish soldiers shot him in the chest. The bullet, which killed him, left a :scar on the forehead of my father for the rest of his life.

My grandmother married twice more after that. My father was 13 years old when he arrived in the United States and at 15 he became an orphan. After this :incredible start in his life, he finished the Colgate University and married my mother, an American whose grandfather fought in the Civil War between the North :and the South. My father wanted to take his wife and children to Bulgaria but he did not succeed.

I have always felt that the heritage of the two peoples in my blood has kept my spirit. And now, as I am growing old, I am even happier for my good fortune. My :father's people have met me warmly and have given me a high prize the Cyrille and Methodius Order (First Class). I was elected a foreign member of the :Bulgarian Academy of Sciences and I am in touch with many friends in Bulgaria. "

https://web.archive.org/web/20180306172639/http://www.johnatanasoff.com:80/pride_in_Bulgaria.php

btw the source for the summers doesn't even have the word "summer" in it, let alone anything else regarding the citation. I am not 100% sure how this works, but I don't suppose that you are expected to dug into the sources for outer sources to verify the statements. Metal Phantom (talk) 14:27, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

As you agree, the list says "The list comprises people from Bulgaria and also people of predominantly Bulgarian heritage." Not half, predominantly. That there may be other names on the list that don't meet the criteria means they should be removed, not that we should ignore the criteria. How long they spent in Bulgaria is irrelevant to their heritage so I'm not clear why you are discussing it. I'm very concerned that you don't accept that you can be Bulgarian even if you are Jewish. We aren't looking for some sort of "pure-blooded" Bulgarians. Canetti's parents were Bulgarians, that should be enough. I've removed Djerassi. Doug Weller talk 16:43, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

I wouldn't even say Atanasoff was half Bulgarian. He was American, born in America, his father was basically American, too, of Bulgarian origin—born in Bulgaria, but immigrated to the US as a 13 year old child, 14 years before John Vincent Atanasoff was born. His mother was of French and Irish ancestry. Putting him on the "List of Bulgarian inventors and discoverers" would be absolutely ridiculous, and nothing more than a nationalist POV pushing that Filipz123 has been trying to do with his countless sock puppets in this article and many other similar nationalist lists. (By the way, I would suggest removing "and also people of predominantly Bulgarian heritage" from the description, as it only serves this disingenuous nationalist manipulation. The title clearly says "List of Bulgarian inventors and discoverers" and the article should stick to it.)

It does not matter what Atanasoff said about his spirit or whether there are other people on this list who do not meet the criteria. Atanasoff clearly should not be on this list.—J. M. (talk) 17:15, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

"I'm very concerned that you don't accept that you can be Bulgarian even if you are Jewish. "

Lol! Strawman much?

I have never said that, you tweeb! Despite Jews and Bulgarians being two distinctive ethno-cultural groups in general, I've never even hinted and even outright said I DON'T argue their heritage. We have some famous Bulgarians who have jewish ancestry, like Etienne Levy.

Is this the way you keep the conversation "civil" and "polite", by hurling allegations and accusations? Discuss arguments, not those who made the arguments... have you even read the pages you linked on my Talk page?

"We aren't looking for some sort of "pure-blooded" Bulgarians. "

Have I made the impression that I was or that I was alleging you did?

My question was simple, what are "you looking for", whoever "you" are. Do I have to play some sick game of ask and guess?

"I've removed Djerassi. "

Why? I explicitly stated I do not argue his heritage, nor his place on the page.

Is this some next level trolling?

"I wouldn't even say Atanasoff was half Bulgarian. He was American, born in America, his father was basically American, too, of Bulgarian origin—born in Bulgaria, but immigrated to the US as a 13 year old child, 14 years before John Vincent Atanasoff was born. His mother was of French and Irish ancestry. "

Are you sure his mother wasn't entirely of "American" ancestry, given her grandfather fought in the civil war? x) When you get a nationality does that entirely erase and change your heritage, including your ethnic ancestry along with your cultural one? By your logic, Barack Obama wasn't the first Black President, bcs he's only half, perhaps not even that much of african-american ancestry. Seems like Morgan Freeman was right after all.

"Putting him on the "List of Bulgarian inventors and discoverers" would be absolutely ridiculous, and nothing more than a nationalist POV pushing that Filipz123 has been trying to do with his countless sock puppets in this article and many other similar nationalist lists. "

And who the f@ck is Filipz123 and what do I have to do with him and "nationalist lists"?

If someone is "disingenuously nationalistic" here it's not me. Bcs it wasn't me that brought up this inane topic of "nationalism" and "Pure Blood".

You have my sympathies for whatever traumatising experience that you might have had regarding this particular topic and that Filipz123, but I haven't given you a single reason to take it out on me.

Regarding Atanasoff... Yes, his father was brought to the US when he was 13 by his mother, yes Atanasoff was half ethnic Bulgarian with American nationality, in terms of heritage he was honored by the Bulgarian government and received the highest order medal of honor and was a Foreign Member of the Bulgarian Academy of Sciences.

I never insisted even insisted that he absolutely should've been added to the list, I was rather genuinely wondering what are the reasons for him not being in the list, given he seemingly qualifies, especially compared some of the others present, but instead of an answer I got self-righteous scolding and instead adding his name you removed another one.

"(By the way, I would suggest removing "and also people of predominantly Bulgarian heritage" from the description, as it only serves this disingenuous nationalist manipulation. The title clearly says "List of Bulgarian inventors and discoverers" and the article should stick to it.) It does not matter what Atanasoff said about his spirit or whether there are other people on this list who do not meet the criteria. Atanasoff clearly should not be on this list."

Clearly? How exactly?

What's the exact definition of "Bulgarian inventors and discoverers", given the inconsistencies and it's obviously not so "clear" when you can't even give me a simple basic definition yourself.

That's what I was asking, but instead of a simple and concise answer I got anti-semitism and chauvinism accusations hurled my way. Real mature, very rich.

"It does not matter what Atanasoff said about his spirit or whether there are other people on this list who do not meet the criteria. "

I've given you citations from his Wikipedia page which noted facts, not what he or anyone else said. And if the inconsistency doesn't matter, what does? You mean that anyone can go and put up whatever they like regardless of actual real world facts and consistency? That's not very objective.

For I only asked a simply question, which you didn't even bother to have an honest discussion and no discussion at all. Throwing insulting hints and presumption at me with any reason and justification.

I ask you again, for a clear definition of what means "Bulgarian inventors and discoverers" and what qualifies one as such? Is this so hard to answer or are you now gonna remove the whole page entirely?

Is what I was asking so "controversial" or something?

I really don't understand you guys.

Metal Phantom (talk) 20:19, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

How is John Atanasoff not Bulgarian?

He had Bulgarian ancestry and is widely revered in Bulgaria today. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Epitome of Creativity (talk • contribs) 05:53, 29 December 2020 (UTC)

Please read this page before asking the same question again. Atanasoff was American. His father was American, born in Bulgaria (immigrated to America as a 13-year-old child, 14 years before John Atanasoff was born), his mother was of French/Irish ancestry. In other words, he was far from being even half-Bulgarian—with mixed American, Bulgarian, Irish and French ancestry. The fact that he is revered in Bulgaria does not make him Bulgarian. This article only lists people from Bulgaria and people of predominantly Bulgarian heritage. Atanasoff was objectively neither.—J. M. (talk) 06:25, 29 December 2020 (UTC)