Talk:Languages of Scotland

No mention of census data

According to the 2011 census the most widely spoken languages in Scotland are:

1. English
2. Scots
3. Polish
4. Urdu
5. Punjabi

[1]

At present this article does not reflect this diversity. Is there a good reason? If not can we rectify? (ricjl (talk) 18:15, 13 November 2019 (UTC))

Potential

This article has a lot of potential and id intended to start something along these lines for some time before User:Canaen beat me to the punch! Could do with some attention from a historical linguist well acquainted with the history of language in Scotland. siarach 16:54, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Anglic dab

Yes, a much better link. Mutt Lunker (talk) 23:31, 10 April 2012 (UTC)

Beware Sabotage: there is no Scots Language

Once again over-enthusiastic Scots nationalists are sabotaging history by claiming that 'Scots' is a different language from English. It isn't. Any objective researcher who takes the time to dig into the facts will discover that the bulk of the inhabitants of present day Scotland have been speaking English not 'Scots' for a thousand years. The varous Scots 'dialects' are no more and no less than some of the multitide of regional vernacular Englishes spoken all around Britain. Scots is English: English is Scots. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.5.15.220 (talk) 18:44, 15 June 2012 (UTC)

Thank's for your opinion. When a researcher (objective or not) publishes a statement to that effect we will consider putting it in the article.(and what is English by the way? Isn't it just a local variant of American that has its historical roots in Northern Germany?)·ʍaunus·snunɐw· 18:58, 15 June 2012 (UTC)

The British Government, well-known for their over-enthusiastic Scots nationalist tendencies, "recognises that Scots and Ulster Scots meet the Charter's definition of a regional or minority language". 79.236.195.171 (talk) 10:25, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

To be clear to those not of native (British) English, the preceding comment is both factual and rather sarcastic... The British Government is more known for its over-enthusiastic suppression of Scots nationalist tendencies c.f. many of the laws and changes that Brexit has brought that have curtailed and restricted Scottish (as well as Welsh and Northern Irish) nationalist agendas. *<:@) 2020/12/10 20:40

The idea that ‘Scots’ is or had once been a language distinct from English first surfaced in John Jamieson’s ‘An Etymological Dictionary of the Scottish Language’ published in 1808.

Jamieson’s history and logic were examined in great detail and shown to be false in James Murray’s extensive examination of the subject - The Dialect of the Southern Counties of Scotland published in 1873. It is available on-line.

The idea of a Scots language was however resurrected in the 1920s by the founders of the SNP movement. Most modern material, mainly published since the 1970s, appears to have been written by individuals also closely associated with Scottish nationalism.

James Costa’s 2009 paper, ‘Language history as charter myth? Scots and the (re)invention of Scotland’ is also available on-line. It also examinies some of the mythology. http://halshs.archives-ouvertes.fr/docs/00/63/24/32/PDF/Costa_chartermyth_final.pdf

Cassandra — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.99.244.41 (talk) 14:23, 15 June 2016 (UTC)

And still ”misinterpreting” these sources. Mutt Lunker (talk) 16:16, 15 June 2016 (UTC)

Also see comments above... if the British Government is willing to acknowledge it then insistence that Scots is not its own language seem to be rather extremist... particularly in light of the Cockney article referring to Cockney as a dialect. *<:@) 2020/12/10 20:40

Percentages

It's the strangest thing, and I say this with a friendly tone, almost laughing, it is well known that Scots speakers are the least likely to admit they are speaking Scots but say they (we) are speaking English.. sure for the internet, I am well aware I write in English, it is the international language, I get that. Most English speaking nations say that Scots is different. I'm not going to edit anything. I, in fact, totally believe those percentages, because those are the percentages I saw last time I checked a few years ago, that over 50% of Scots speakers believe they are speaking English. (85% total, only 30% believe, 55% do not believe). Dava4444 (talk) 18:31, 26 June 2017 (UTC)

What amuses me most about this is my own experience (therefore entirely worthless, empirically speaking :) is that Glaswegian speakers of Weegie are the most ardent people I known that they are speaking English at the same time as being unintelligible to Scots, never mind English, speakers!! :D *<:@) 2020:12:10 20:50 (JST)

Differences between languages

As has already been discussed, there are different levels of recognition between the Scots language and Scottish Standard English (and English too perhaps). To demonstrate the difference, I think the addition of examples demonstrating the difference may be a useful addition to the article (although where I don't know). I've taken an existing example and added a Scots translation.

Examples of grammatical and lexeme differences between English, Scottish Standard English and Scots

English	Scottish Standard English	Scots
May I come too?	Can I come too?	Can a come ana?
I should, if I were you.	I would, if I was you.	A wid, if a wis ye.
My hair needs/wants washing.	My hair needs washed.	Ma hares needin washen/washt.
He won't do that.	He'll not do that.	He'll no dae that.
Does anyone know?	Does anybody know?	Dis onybody ken?

Gàidhlig could be added too, but I don't possess those translation skills.2A02:C7F:8ECF:9900:4D76:7050:F803:2D47 (talk) 10:54, 9 July 2020 (UTC)

References

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• Coat of Arms of Scotland (1660-1689).svg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 17:43, 30 January 2023 (UTC)