Talk:Kip McKean

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What were the "sins"?

'[McKean] cited ongoing family problems, apologized for his own arrogance and said that his sins "have weakened and embittered many in our churches", and "these sins have surfaced in my family as well as the church,"' says the article, but there are no details. The ICOC article is similarly vague. Was he screwing around? Embezzling? Both? There's no need for an encyclopedia to hem-haw around. 99.203.22.226 (talk) 15:14, 22 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

There are no ACADEMIC sources of his "sins." ( aka arrogance during leading ) therefore they cannot be listed. Citing a personal blog isn't a reasonable source for wiki therefore the information must remain as is. Since we are 14+ years removed from such events, I personally doubt anything will surface in an academic text. I'm sure there are better pages to edit and focus on at this point vs a C-rated page. Coachbricewilliams28 (talk) 19:31, 10 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Brice Williams, in his own words, is a "Sold-out Disciple at City of Angels International Christian Church Central Region." Brice Williams should not be editing anything as he has a conflict of interest WP:COI. He also has an WP:NPOV issue in that he will tend to edit out anything negative about Kip Mckean whether it is factual or not. Qewr4231 (talk) 06:04, 20 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

You can find a copy of Kip's 2002 Resignation here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dSsXbEptKoMOJXwIxEmQ8XoGUZntoFbr/view?usp=sharing

The sins included:

Elitism

Anger

Pride

Then the ICOC published these two letters in October 2005 and then November 2005:

https://disciplestoday.org/brothers-letter-to-kip-mckean/

https://disciplestoday.org/commentary-perspectives-item-409-brothers-statement-to-kip-mckean1/ Spirituallarryflynt (talk) 02:25, 3 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The Standard of Wikipedia Citations and Affiliated Materials

JB,

    The "LONGSTANDING" material isn't Wiki appropriate. If it was, you would've been perfectly fine with my expanded ICC imitation of your Icoc page. Since we can't have double standards, lets make sure that anything posted on what is unnecessarily a controversial page is restricted to truly Wikipedia appropriate data. Most of the things you are in favor of was written by Kip himself or former affiliates! While I'm all for expanding this page, if it doesn't have a ISBN, or AT LEAST an academic foundation, it doesn't belong. It doesn't matter if it is true or not, ( ie: where he went to college ) , it isn't wikipedia approved based on the standards we established mid-last year with the old icc page. For the sake of unity ( Phil 2 ) let's be unified on this. Coachbricewilliams28 (talk) 18:57, 26 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

JaimeBrown2011If what he writes IS indeed acceptable, show me the WP and we can add in THOSE entries. Coachbricewilliams28 (talk) 18:59, 26 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

JaimeBrown2011 WP:SELFPUB <--- Is a real thing. Well in that case, this page only needs a cleanup from the non-academic sources Thomas did not publish. That will be easier. I'll comment later as to what citation #'s I think this would be. Coachbricewilliams28 (talk) 23:59, 26 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

JaimeBrown2011 Ok, now that I have a free moment: Citation # 6,9,10,11,12,13,18 & 19 do not meet wiki standards. if you feel otherwise, please list off the # and the reasoning why you feel it is academic enough considering our former ideology of "presumed accuracy" is no longer valid. Additionally, I would like to recommend THIS AUTOBIOGRAPHY & HISTORY of the Icoc to Icc written by Kip himself since it will fill in the gaps from the voids these soon to be deleted citations will bring. Coachbricewilliams28 (talk) 22:55, 21 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Coachbricewilliams, since you have only really edited Kip McKeans church page and his personal page you haven’t realized that each Wikipage works on the highest quality sources possible. If it is not a particularly noteworthy subject without a lot of academic sources, then as long as the lower level are not highly controversial, they can be used. Hence the reason that WP Admins have edited this page and allowed those sources you are so keen to throw out. JamieBrown2011 (talk) 05:34, 24 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@jb, I'll overlook your lack of Ephesians 4 adherence and spit out the bones in that half-truth statement. We've been in this game long enough to know eachother so we may as well attempt to play nice. The link cited above is by far the best historical account on the Icoc to Icc history. I'm sure I'll have time to add it in sometime. Coachbricewilliams28 (talk) 14:47, 25 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Kip Mckean

Who is Kip Mckean? Is he a noteworthy person? Someone who should be included in an encyclopedia? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:1700:4260:35D0:1483:70F8:956D:F556 (talk) 21:04, 13 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

^ Not really in the "encyclopedia" sense. The only reason this page exists is because FORMER members of his churches upkeep it. The church page was deleted a long while back and this page has been up for deletion a handful of times. Parties not in his churches at some point have no interest in the existence of this page really. Coachbricewilliams28 (talk) 23:56, 21 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The Wiki page on ICOC is alive and well. International Churches of Christ thought1 (talk) 00:27, 11 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Can you verify these statements? XZealous (talk) 13:09, 7 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

A brief browsing of the contributors confirms that the majority of edits are done by current or former members. These individuals are frankly the only people on the planet with any logical connection to Mr. McKean or his various 501c3's. This church isn't exactly a prominent denomination so the niche interest especially by former members with church hurt is prevalent. This topic has been discussed a few times in delete proposals and assessments of NPOV. Coachbricewilliams28 (talk) 17:35, 8 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reliable Sources Board

I opened up a thread, Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard#ICOC-ICC Lawsuits, at the reliable sources noticeboard in discussion with a website used in this article. XZealous (talk) 18:35, 16 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]