Talk:Jewish Voice for Peace

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Reception

This is a hit piece section. It will be dramatically reduced in size. Makeandtoss (talk) 20:23, 22 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Good idea. This came up in November as well but did not get comprehensively addressed. There is a related issue of overquoting too. JArthur1984 (talk) 02:57, 23 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I agree that the section grossly overrepresents JVP's critics, but I do feel that the information is relevant and worth having available. I'm thinking of organizing the information, cutting back some of the quotes and more inflammatory language, and moving it to a separate page for criticisms/controversies. A much shorter, more balanced reception section can wikilink to that page. Thoughts? NuanceQueen (talk) 23:18, 29 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I believe separate "Criticism" articles are generally disfavored and considered a WP:povfork. But the idea of continuing to reduce quotations and such seems very wise. Although there have been some various efforts made to reduce quotations since November, there is more to do. I would encourage that if you are interested! JArthur1984 (talk) 00:20, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@JArthur1984 Gotcha, thanks! I'm pretty new to this, so I don't have extended protection permissions yet, but I'll check back when I do and see if it still needs cleaning up. NuanceQueen (talk) 02:24, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Welcome to Wikipedia, and happy editing. JArthur1984 (talk) 02:45, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, I have a heavily condensed version with some additional information on post-10/7 coverage in my Sandbox if someone with editing permissions wants to take a look at it. NuanceQueen (talk) 19:07, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I do. I'll have a look. Dhantegge (talk) 22:57, 18 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, there's nothing there. You must have already implemented those changes. Dhantegge (talk) 22:59, 18 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Dhantegge Yeah, I got confirmed eventually and implemented the changes myself. Thanks, though! NuanceQueen (talk) 04:27, 19 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Correction

While there may be a few factual errors, there has been a concerted campaign against the political positions of Jewish Voice for Peace. This article seems, in its intent balanced. The only thing I can see that may be problematic is the fact that there is any lengthy introduction to JVP, no matter how neutral it is. JVP is no longer afforded the modest welcome from the Anti-Defamation League suggested by former leader Abe Foxman's declaration on anti-zionism: that if an anti-zionist one is opposed to a Jewish homeland he/she is anti-Semitic; but if one is opposed to nationalism across the board, then to be opposed to Zionism may not be anti-Semtic. The more recent CEO of ADL Jonathan Greenblatt changed the orientation and the open embrace of the organization, stating that if one is anti-zionist one is "anti-Semitic. Full stop." The result was the resignation of key staff. ADL, along with AIPAC have encouraged campaigns to bring down the esteem of the organization founded by Tony Kushner, Noam Chomsky, Naomi Klein, Wallace Shawn and other liberal Jewish Luminaries, all of them subtle thinkers and writers. Let people be informed about the organization and make up their own minds, rather than taking down all neutral. One needs only to look at the current ADL website to see what (non-neutral) enmity this has aroused. This entry is by and large sound. It is not for non-authors to determine that an entry presents the organization the way it wants to present itself. Disclaimer: I am not a member of JVP, nor any "anti-Semitic" organization. 66.44.26.19 (talk) 19:28, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

What exactly is the change in the article you want to argue for? Your contribution is not very clear, but reads like a rambling forum post. --Hob Gadling (talk) 06:24, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Non-neutral wording in Reception section

Scholarly research has found that JVP is a group that organically mobilizes American Jewish activists in support of anticolonial struggle and "justice and equality for all in Israel and Palestine", also noting that its leaders are "women and queer people who readily identify as feminist".

This wording falsely presents a scholarly consensus that JVP "is a group [we know] that organically mobilizes American Jewish activists [what?] in support of anticolonial struggle and 'justice and equality for all in Israel and Palestine'." The "also noting" bit has nothing to do with reception. In general the quote doesn't pertain to reception. I am removing it, but initiating this discussion in case anyone contests that and wants to discuss. ꧁Zanahary꧂ (talk) 19:23, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Description of JVP as "far-left"

The article's "views" section implies that JVP is described as "specifically far-left," but this is highly misleading. JVP's focus is on opposing Israel and defending Palestinian rights within the context of the Israel-Palestine conflict, without advocating for economic or revolutionary goals typically associated with far-left politics.

Most sources do not describe JVP as "far-left" if you search for pages assocating the two terms will almost only find pages of pro-israel advocacy groups or news articles quoting them and pages of Israeli news sites. It appears the editor cherry-picked specific articles to suggest that JVP is generally characterized this way.

A pro-Palestine and anti-Israel position even if it goes outside of the mainstream stance on the United States is not enough for someone or some organization to be characterized as "far-left". Since many individuals in all parts of the poltical spectrum holds that positions including many right-wingers and libertarians, it does not necessarly has anything to do with the left-right political spectrum.

It’s also worth noting that the positions JVP takes on the Israeli-Palestine conflict would be generally considered centrist or even too moderate by most Palestinians and muslims in the world.

The views section should state that many Israeli news outlets, pro-Israel advocacy groups and some american news articles have described them as "far-left" due to their radical opposition to Israel or it should just remove the mention of this label.

Lucasdmca (talk) 15:09, 30 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I think you need to avoid SYNTH in making that edit, and the approach may be to use more specific attribution. This characterization is sufficiently sourced for the body, but I would agree if you want to remove it from the lead due to concerns about UNDUE weight. As a general matter, I do not recommend too much emphasis on left-right political labels; this organization may be "left-wing" in a United States national context or an Israel national context, but as you are pointing out that does not make much sense from a WP:GLOBAL perspective. In the lead, we already have the more specific description of its position as anti-Zionism. It's better to rely on more concrete expressions of position or policy or actions where we can. JArthur1984 (talk) 16:14, 30 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yep, left or right wing, fair enough if the sources are there to support that, but the "far" bit is stretching things, sounds partisan. Selfstudier (talk) 16:48, 30 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. Remove from lead and express more carefully (e.g. "described as left-wing and sometimes [rather than specifically] as far left") in the body. These terms are very relative and contentious, and unless most reliable sources use the term it's better to stick to the larger and less contentious label. BobFromBrockley (talk) 14:19, 31 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]