Talk:Jake Burns

This article was nominated for deletion on 18 September 2020. The result of the discussion was no consensus.

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Biography: Musicians

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Some issues

Generally, there seem to be too many irrelevant details which properly belong in the Stiff Little fingers entry, not here. For example, how relevant are the references to the "Suspect Device" sleeve, the reason for Ali McMordie leaving, reference to Beirut Moon being withdrawn (which incidentally, I'm still not convinced is accurate) and two references to Steve Grantley having played with the Big Wheel seems unnecessary.

There's no reference to Three Men and Black, a project Jake's been involve with for a number of years, and only a brief mention of his one true 'solo' album.

On a more pedantic note, I'm pretty sure the reference to Stiff Little Fingers taking their name from "a copy of The Vibrators London Girls single" is inaccurate - there's an interview somewhere in which Jake specifically dismisses this, stating that it was in fact an album. I'll dig it out and update. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Teambb1 (talk • contribs) 20:13, 11 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Vibrators

A pedant writes: I was right about Stiff Little Fingers getting their name from a Vibrators album rather than a single. I just looked up the matter in Jake and Alan Parkers "Stiff Little Fingers: Song By Song" book. Here's what it says: "AP: ... just to destroy another great Stiff Little Fingers urban myth that you were named after a B-Side, nobody in he band actually owned 'London girls' on 7in? JB: Not as far as I know, no. It was off the album - it was the album sleeve. That's where we got it from". There doesn't seem much point in amending the entry here as I don't see that it holds any specific relevance to the Jake Burns entry anyway, so I'm removing it altogether, but I'll amend the Stiff Little Fingers entry and cite the source. Kevin Boyd 21:48, 23 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

28/10/07: Okay, so it seems that someone is determined to retain the Vibrators reference but they don't seem to have taken on board the quotation given above. So I've updated and corrected the entry, which now reads that the name was "taken from the song of the same name by the Vibrators which had appeared on their 1977 Pure Mania album." This seems much more satisfactory (and apparently accurate in light of Burns' comments already quoted above) to me. Just to push the point, Ive also added an HTML requesting that this not be 'corrected' and pointing people in ther direction of this discussion. Glad to discuss/debate this or any other issue here if necessary. Kevin Boyd 09:28, 28 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Personal Life

An anonymous user keeps deleting the Personal Life section. No sure why but I think it may be something to do with the reference to Liverpool FC (as that particular reference has itself been deleted in the past with the rest of the section being retained).

I think it's important that Burns' marriage to Shirley Sexton is acknowledged - particularly as she has increasingly become the public face of SLF through her involvement with the website and discussion forum, etc. I also think it's important that Burns' support of Newcastle FC is given a mention, as this is something he's made constant reference to over many years (even to the extent that SLF merchandise has been made to resemble the Newcastle strip). But I think we can live without the Liverpool FC reference - much as it pains me to say so, being a Liverpool fan myself - especially if this avoids having the whole section removed again. But on a related note, I think it should be mentioned that Burns has become a Chicago Cubs fan since moving to the city.

So, I'm going to reinstate this section, adding reference to the Chicago Cubs but omitting the reference to Liverpool FC. I'll also add an HTML note directing potential editors to this discussion and maybe if there's a particular reason this section keeps getting removed we can have a discussion about it here. Here's hoping... Kevin Boyd 09:50, 28 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I'm interested in why you think the reference to Burns having been a Liverpool supporter for a number of years is not relevant? It is a matter of public knowledge that he did indeed support Liverpool Football Club, before changing his affiliation to Newcastle. Jcuk 21:41, 29 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I absolutely agree. But I get the impression that whoever keeps removing this entire section is doing so at least partly because of the reference to Liverpool - petty I know but that's the way things appear to be. So my point really is not that Burns' previous allegiance to Liverpool is not relevant, just that we can probably live without it in the article if it means the section doesn't keep getting removed. Not an ideal situation certainly, and not something we should necessarily have to put up with, but in all fairness it's probably a relatively minor detail in the Burns biography. Kevin Boyd 22:46, 29 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

There is a good reference for Jake swapping club alliegences, if anyone has the energy to add it and tidy up the Personal Life section: http://www.themag.co.uk/the-mag-articles/jake-burns-falling-in-love-with-newcastle-united/. Pollythewasp (talk) 13:14, 19 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Belfast

The article fails to mention what part of Belfast Burns grew up in.I was told it was Andersonstown.jeanne (talk) 13:46, 15 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Attempts at deletion

There was a (defective) proposed deletion here and that has been effectively vacated. No new proposed deletion is allowed. No CSD criterion applies.

The comments associated with the deletion include the ludicrous claim of "no references", which does not apply to the article as of its state here on 2020-09-17. There are problems with the quality of references that could be discussed in an AfD discussion.

A determination of not-notable, after this long tenure, requires a discussion at AfD. There was a request here by Wikiuser2020belfast who appears to claim to be Jake Burns, but they subsequently deleted it and resorted to removing the redirect.

If nobody else chimes in, I'm going to restore the article to its status-quo-ante, before the misguided deletion attempts began, and then bring it up at AfD for a proper discussion. — jmcgnh^{(talk) (contribs)} 22:59, 17 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, I agree this should go to AfD: the article has been around since 2004, has a decent number of refs, and receives over 50 pageviews each day. That's beyond the scope of PROD. – Uanfala (talk) 23:52, 17 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I couldn't agree more! This is pure bullocks!! Jake is a National Treasure. Thanks for keeping the this article alive! --Jauma2368 (talk) 17:49, 18 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I see the SPAs are back at it, trying to delete this article again. Just in case someone starts another AfD, WP:Music says that musicians may be notable if they meet at least one of the following criteria. Jake meets 5 criteria:

1. Has been the subject of multiple, non-trivial, published works - Burns is regularly interviewed by notable magazines and newspapers worldwide, like the Irish News (Ireland) [1][2], Newcity (USA) [3], The Japan Times (Japan) [4], Belfast Telegraph (Northern Ireland) [5], Vice (Canada) [6], Stuff (New Zealand) [7], Morning Star (UK) [8] and Sportskeeda (UK sports mag) [9].

2. Has had a single or album on any country's national music chart - his singles "She Grew Up" and "Breathless" both charted in the UK

5. Has released two or more albums on a major record label - 1. On Fortune Street (2002, EMI), 2. Drinkin' Again (2006, EMI)

6. Is a musician who has been a reasonably prominent member of two or more independently notable ensembles - 1. Stiff Little Fingers, 2. Jake Burns and the Big Wheel, 3. Dead Men Walking

7. Has become one of the most prominent representatives of a notable style - he is a prominent figure in punk rock music. - Robman94 (talk) 22:15, 4 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]