Talk:Isabella de Braose

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography

Women

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Women, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of women on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.WomenWikipedia:WikiProject WomenTemplate:WikiProject WomenWikiProject Women

Defaultsort

When I recently visited 'Category:Princesses of Wales', I saw that almost all of them were sorted under their Christian name, including both ladies of royal birth like Catherine of Aragon and Alexandra of Denmark, and ladies from the nobility of the UK and its predecessor states like Joan of Kent and Diana Princess of Wales. One exception was the subject of this article (who was the wife of the first Prince of Wales). I feel that this implements Wikipedia:Categorization_of_people#Nobility which states that "European princes and princesses are sorted by their given name. Prince Charles is sorted 'DEFAULTSORT:Charles, Prince of Wales'." I felt that, for consistency among members of the same category, they should all be sorted in the format set out above, and amended this page accordingly. User:Dougatwiki reverted this edit, on the basis that 'This reason is nonsensical'. Can I seek the views of other wikipedians? Alekksandr (talk) 15:36, 21 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

If you visit the other category that Isabella is included in, 'Category:Women of medieval Wales', you will see that precisely the opposite is true. While your change was in operation, Isabella was the only woman sorted that way. This meant that she was separated from her sisters and other family members. Isabella is more noted in history as one of the four Braose heiresses than as a princess. In fact it is only on Wikipedia that I have ever seen her referred to this way. Consistency is impossible in this case so I think it preferable that she should be accessible most easily to people looking for her as a Braose family member rather than as a "princess". However, I don't think this is an important issue. Let's wait a bit and see if anyone else has a view.Doug (at Wiki) 15:52, 21 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, for what it's worth, there is general inconsistency in how individuals are sorted in the Women of medieval Wales category. Alekksandr, I would have no objection to your proposed change, as long as you synchronized the format for everyone in that category. Drdpw (talk) 16:38, 21 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your contribution. I had tried to synchronize the format as you suggest for Anne Neville, Caroline of Brunswick (this also applies to them qua queens consort) and Eleanor de Montfort. On the point about separating a woman from her sisters, compare Diana, Princess of Wales (sorted by her Christian name) and her sisters Lady Sarah McCorquodale and Jane Fellowes, Baroness Fellowes (sorted by their surnames) in Category:Daughters_of_British_earls. AIUI, it is possible to sort the same article in different ways in different categories - see Help:Category#Sort_order. Would this be appropriate here? Alekksandr (talk) 17:49, 21 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

That might be an idea. But if it's difficult or time consuming I wouldn't bother. It's probably not possible to get a consistent approach across all categories. I really don't see this as a question worth fussing over. I'll reverse my "undo" for you hereDoug (at Wiki) 18:21, 21 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. Alekksandr (talk) 21:20, 21 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]