Talk:Hofstad Network

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This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 15 January 2019 and 21 May 2019. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Dosskitty.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 23:45, 16 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Possible vandalism

I have been cleaning up vandalism caused by 203.166.99.*. In several articles they posted seemingly accurate information that was false. I encourage verification of their contribution which follows. --Dan East 06:46, July 28, 2005 (UTC)

"In January 2005, after a siege and the arrest of Jason Walters in The Hague, files are found on his computer which show that the Hofstad Network had plans to kills prime minister Jan Peter Balkenende and treasurer Gerrit Zalm."

Thanks for pointing it out, i'll remove it. If anyone wishes to add it back, please provide references. Jacoplane 08:51, 28 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Verification of data can be found in dutch on http://www.nos.nl/nieuws/achtergronden/theovangogh/mohammedb_moordplannen_hofstadgroep.html, which is one of the reference links at the bottom of the document. --WinusB 08:25, 29 July 2005 (AEST)

Duh. I actually added that link to the references some time ago. I guess I should read what I add ;). Anyway, thanks for pointing it out. Jacoplane 22:27, 28 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

No worries mate :o) WinusB 11:47, 29 July 2005 (AEST)

DOB, Not Age

I edited out the ages of the Hofstad Network members, since they cannot be correct anymore. The known years of birth I added. Please add if you know the years.--Dengo 11:50, 16 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Organisation Disputed

I noticed the Dutch entry http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hofstadgroep is disputed. The English entry does not reflect this. Firstly the actual existence of this group is a subject of debate. As far as we know now, the Hofstad Network likely is not an organisation, but a group of individuals denominated as an organisation by the AIVD. Whether this is an actual organisation, and whether their intentions are terrorist, is still being investigated. Secondly, although Mohammed B. has committed the murder of Theo van Gogh and has been convicted for it, none of those mentioned have yet been convicted for terrorist activities (Dec 22 2005 a fourth suspect was acquitted). I don't mean to convey a political message, but calling the Hofstad Network an islamist terrorist organisation probably is factually incorrect except for the "islamist" bit. (Didn't edit the page, just wanted to leave this comment)

I see your point, but it is my view that from the article as a whole it becomes quite clear that almost everything stated in the article are merely suspicions of the public prosecutor and the AIVD. In fact, the individual members of the group are - among other charges - suspected of belonging to a terrorist organisation. I think for now it will suffice to add a small word ('alleged' or 'suspected') to make the situation more clear from the first line of the article. I'd say we wait for the judge's verdict before we completely strike the whole notion. comment: Having said all that, the dutch wikipedian who added the 'disputed' line did so because there apparently is confusion as to the number of members being either 14 or 16, NOT because the Hofstad Network might not be an organisation after all.--Dengo 18:14, 4 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Translation

Hofstad means, loose translated, parliament city.

'Stad' means city, that's correct But 'hof' means 'court' – both in the sense 'garden' as in the sense 'court of law'. The only link between 'hof' and 'parliament' is that the political centre of the Netherlands, including the Tweede Kamer (part of Parliament) is located at 'Binnenhof', literally 'Inner Court'. The translation 'parliament city' is very loose. — Adhemar 193.178.209.214 12:48, 8 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

No it's not 'very loose', it's utter nonsense. The nickname 'Hofstad' for The Hague comes from the fact that the duke of Holland had his court (Hof) there. (This is also the reason all ministries and parliament are in The Hague, but that's beside the point) I must have missed the moment this edit was made, but I am removing it right now.--Dengo 18:12, 8 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Against Dutch law...

This article is against Dutch privacy law. Last Names should be removed and replaced with the first letter of the last name. Please people, these people are suspects, and all but one, still not convicted, which means that they are still innocent and their names should be protected!

Dutch privacy law doesn't really apply on the English wikipedia. Besides, many other media organisations have used these names in full. See for example: BBC, Wall Street Journal and many others. Jacoplane 19:00, 21 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

There is no such thing as a dutch privacy law that says it is illegal to publish full names of suspected or convicted criminals. It is merely a practice in dutch media to use the first letter of the last names. It is an age old convention, but NOT a law! --Dengo 11:28, 23 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Respect that custom, then. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 62.238.92.181 (talk • contribs) 12:13, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Any reason to? We're not Dutch media; we're an English encyclopedia, rather.

Soothing R 14:00, 14 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Their surnames have been published in Dutch media as well and it is a stupid practice anyway (which I can freely say as I'm Dutch). —Ruud 14:25, 14 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Indeed, it is not the Dutch law, but merely a custom or habit of precaution that is generally accepted and respected by the Dutch press: the mentioning of the full personal particulars of a suspect who later was not found guilty can be considered as libellous, at least potentially. Every time when the full name of a suspect in a crime is mentioned in the media in The Netherlands, there follow discussions about it, like last year on the mentioning of the name of Karst T. related to the events in Apeldoorn on April 30, and recently the mentioning of the name of distinguished war hero Marco K. related to a criminal investigation (also see there today). However, let us not forget the principle of presumption of innocence.

Regarding "We're not Dutch media; we're an English encyclopedia, rather": for the legal intricacies of international defamation, see also "Fiona Shevill and others v. Presse Alliance S.A. (1995). Also, there really does exist a "Dutch privacy law", the "Wet bescherming persoonsgegevens", but this custom or habit of the press has nothing to do with that--JanDeFietser (talk) 16:45, 6 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Reverting Vandalism...

I reverted this article back to 2008, due to a lot of minor vandalism, mixed in with good edits. It was too difficult to separate the good from the bad. This article does need additional sources and citations also. Take Care... Dinkytown talk 00:41, 2 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Either verify or shut down this page

25 who/what/when/citations needed and yet this is still up and running for years ? This is not worthy of Wikipedia RhoSevenOh (talk) 20:22, 29 January 2022 (UTC)Rho[reply]