Talk:Good King Wenceslas

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Good King Wenceslas article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: 1: 3 years

Czech poem as source?

According to the article, "In 1853, English hymnwriter John Mason Neale translated the lyric from a Czech poem by Václav Alois Svoboda." This line appears to have been added in December 2022 by a Wikipedia editor, in good faith, apparently on the basis of their private research. While the poem and the carol plainly rely on the same legend for their material, I am not so sure it follows that Neale directly translated the poem. Are there any reliable secondary sources which support this claimed dependence? 31.94.69.18 (talk) 13:08, 11 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Hmm, no doesn't look right does it - the lyrics are essentially a poem version of this book for children. Might remove that. Rob (talk) 14:51, 11 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Calendar information isn't all that useful

"In Eastern Christianity, it is December 27. During Wenceslas's time, the Julian Calendar was in use. During the 900s, the day that they called December 26 was actually December 31 according to the Gregorian Calendar (the current calendar). And the day that they called December 27 was January 1."

In this passage, readers are advised that there would have been a five-day gap between the Julian and Gregorian calendars, supposing the latter calendar had been in existence at that time (which, of course, it wasn't). But is it usual, or even meaningful, to project the Gregorian calendar back in time like this? I know it can be done as a theoretical exercise, I just don't really see the point of "converting" 10th-century dates.

If Victorian hymnwriter J.M. Neale was the first to associate Wenceslas with St Stephen's Day, then talk of variant calendars and dates is a waste of time, anyway. Nobody doubts that he had 26 December in mind when he wrote his popular carol. 31.94.22.212 (talk) 20:35, 12 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's well-known as the Proleptic Gregorian calendar, but I'm not sure how relevant it is to this article. AnonMoos (talk) 01:37, 13 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Interesting link, thanks (I never knew it had a special name!). I think a detailed analysis of the date might well be appropriate, if we were trying to unravel an incident which history or legend recorded as having occurred on an actual St Stephen's Day in the 900s. It just seems a little unreal for the article to be troubling itself with such intricacies, if the idea of setting the events "on the Feast of Stephen" originated with Neale at his writing desk. 31.94.22.101 (talk) 20:44, 13 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

King Wenceslas or not?

In the brief description: "tells a story of a tenth-century king of Bohemia"

In the source material: "Wenceslas is not to be confused with King Wenceslaus I of Bohemia (Wenceslaus I Premyslid), who lived more than three centuries later." 98.24.40.6 (talk) 01:52, 26 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]