Talk:Frost weathering

Potholes are not frost weathering

The The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers' Cold Regions Research & Engineering Laboratory originally published "Pothole Primer: A Public Administrator's Guide to Understanding and Managing the Pothole Problem" (Special Report 81-21) in September 1981 explains that pothles are simply the result of water-saturated soil, plus traffic. A review article (http://www.usroads.com/journals/rmj/9702/rm970204.htm) explains, "One result is potholes, especially in the spring when water saturates the roadway's ground support and weakens its ability to stand up to heavy traffic." So, frost effects are a contributing, not primary cause of potholes. I plan to delete the reference from this article. --User:HopsonRoad 14:09, 18 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

This isn't a "Main Article," yet

This article is barely different than the section with the same name in Weathering. Unless there are plans to expand it substantially, I feel that it should be merged with Weathering. --User:HopsonRoad 01:36, 20 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

A more logical merge would be with ice segregation. Cheers - Williamborg (Bill) 01:58, 5 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Frost weathering about rock, not soil systems

This article confuses frost-induced heaving mechanisms with freeze-thaw induced weathering of rock. It should only be the latter. See for, example, a University of Oslo lecture on periglacial geomorphology. It states that, "Frost weathering is controlled by geology:"

• Rocks with high porosity are frost sensitive

• Very permeable rocks are not frost sensitive

• Poorly consolidated rocks are frost sensitive

• Rock fracturing improve weathering.

Therefore, I propose to limit this article to rock only. User:HopsonRoad 00:43, 12 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Frost weathering in rock

An IP editor has suggested that freeze-thaw cycles are not a significant factor in frost weathering. I would like to see more thorough discussion here. For example:

Matsuoka, 1990 suggests that: "Five-year observations revealed that the bedrock shattering rate was usually much higher in the freeze-thaw period from October to next May than in the frost-free period from June to September. This indicates that frost action is the most important shattering process...."
Matsuoka, 1990 studies "Diurnal freeze–thaw depth in rockwalls" and concludes "The frost and thaw depths are considered to give the maximum estimation of the depth to which frost-induced cracking can propagate in the bedrock."
Matsuoka et al., 1997 conclude that "Diurnal frost heave and creep prevail on crest debris slopes, while basal debris slopes experience large frost heave during seasonal freezing and thawing."
Matuoka and Murton, 2008 state, "Field monitoring has highlighted the roles of diurnal and annual frost cycles in controlling the timing and magnitude of frost weathering."

Unfortunately, I can't see the papers in detail. However, the abstracts make the above points clear. User:HopsonRoad 22:30, 16 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Volumetric expansion isn't consistent with patterns of frost weathering. It occurs in some cases but is less important than segregation ice growth, and sustained temperatures below freezing cause more weathering than freeze-thaw cycles (e.g., Girard et al., 2013). The time spent at ideal temperatures for segregation ice is more important.

I also can't not question the reasoning behind deleting a referenced statement without looking at the reference — paywalls are not exactly unusual in science. 128.223.223.134 (talk) 00:49, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for replying here. Please be more understanding of a person who can't see behind the various paywalls. I merely noted, when I reverted your earlier edit, that the edit left in place a reference to freeze-thaw, while deprecating its role in the edit comment.

Because this article hasn't reached the level of quality, where one can be sure that it has received expert attention, edits from IP editors whose contributions are difficult to monitor rouse suspicions about their provenance. It appears that you have the expertise that could greatly improve this article. But forgive me for reverting one of your edits that suggested that frost weathering took place at temperatures above freezing; it wasn't clear at that point whether that was a typo or poorly informed editing, since it came from yet another IP address. I understand from the helpful reference that you supplied above that the temperature interval (−8 to −3°C) is a "frost cracking window", which presumably is the most productive regime for ice segregation and frost cracking intensity.

BTW, it would facilitate communication with you, if you opted to get a user name. That way, one could see if you are just one editor writing from now four IP addresses and not a different editor with each IP address. Sincerely, User:HopsonRoad 04:45, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]