Talk:Eliminationism

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Reliable sources

Reliable sources for Eliminationism on Google Scholar --Loremaster (talk) 01:55, 26 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Notability is questionable

Right now this article is about a political term which was essentially coined by David Neiwert and has been used by him and a few other people. The notability of that term hasn't been established. Most Google Scholar results are about Goldhagen's "eliminationist antisemitism," which is adequately covered in other articles, or about Eliminative materialism.Prezbo (talk) 00:32, 15 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Whether or not you are right that “eliminationism” is a neologism, I disagree that it was coined by David Neiwert. It was in fact coined by Goldhagen.

In the AlterNet article The Terrorist Threat: Right-Wing Radicals and the Eliminationist Mindset, Neiwert stated:

Well, eliminationism is of course longstanding thing. It's not just something new. We have a history of it in the United States, and not just here -- it's a global phenomenon. It's rooted in tribalism, and it goes way back.

The connection to fascism is fairly obvious. I got the term "eliminationism" from Daniel Goldhagen, whose book, Hitler's Willing Executioners, is an examination of how ordinary people facilitated the Holocaust. A pretty good book -- there are some problems with his thesis, but the concept of eliminationism was an important one that I pulled out of the work.

It's fundamental to the fascist world view, because fascism's core project is what Roger Griffin calls palingenesis, which is the phoenixlike rebirth from the ashes of the great national heritage. In order to achieve that rebirth, they have to eliminate and destroy -- they have to burn down what exists, and that includes eliminating those who are the cause of their problems. So for the German fascists that was Jews and communists and socialists. They did indeed proceed to eliminate them.

That being said, my intent is not to promote the word “eliminationism” as much it is to have a Wikipedia article document a phenomenon that has existed for a long time without there being a more precise word for it until 1996. --Loremaster (talk) 02:05, 15 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

It's not about your intent. I haven't read Goldhagen's book so I don't know if he talks about "eliminationism" in general or only about "eliminationist antisemitism." Either way Niewert at least popularized the term, the definition of it given in this article is his definition, and its use appears to be limited to Niewert and a few other people.Prezbo (talk) 03:12, 15 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

http://www.newstatesman.com/books/2010/02/genocide-goldhagen-mass According to I read Goldhagen published a book in October 2009 entitled Worse Than War: Genocide, Eliminationism and the Ongoing Assault on Humanity. According to John Gray, the New Statesman's lead book reviewer:

In Hitler's Willing Executioners (1996), Goldhagen argued that Germans were largely active supporters of Nazi "eliminationism" - an ideology that justified the extermination of minorities, above all Jews, as necessary and right. Goldhagen's claim that many, if not most Germans enthusiastically endorsed Hitler's genocidal policies was predictably controversial and brought him worldwide recognition. His argument that Germany had nurtured a uniquely virulent, "eliminationist" type of anti-Semitism over generations has been forcefully disputed by historians for conflating the hatreds of the interwar era with German culture as a whole (and for neglecting eliminationist anti-Semitism in other countries). But Goldhagen, who rarely refers to other scholars except to dismiss them, is unfazed by these objections. Instead, he has upped the stakes and extended his analysis to cover virtually every kind of mass killing perpetrated in recent times.1

That being said, you are right that Niewert popularized the term and that the definition of it given in this article is his definition. However, the word is used by more than just three people. So let's work on expanding the article. --Loremaster (talk) 03:22, 15 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

If Goldhagen is also now promoting this as a general concept then that's probably enough to meet WP:N I guess.Prezbo (talk) 03:35, 15 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Perfect. I guess I should thank you for pushing me to find information to justify the existence of this article but also expand and improve it! --Loremaster (talk) 03:56, 15 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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Theodore N. Kaufman and relevance in RS to eliminationism

I can't find any sources that mention Theodore N. Kaufman and eliminationism together other than the Institute for Historical Review.--Pharos (talk) 05:02, 16 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]