Talk:Ed Esber

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Untitled

Hey. This bio sounds like it was written by him. It would be good to check the log and the IP.

BTW. This guy was the 80's version of Steve Ballmer. His "Make my day quote", sounds much like Ballmer's "I'm going to f---ing kill Google.".

I know he was important to the PC industries future, but his attitude suck big time.----201.116.149.85 (talk) 18:31, 16 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

According to several accounts, he actually was behind Ashton-Tate's demise. So it's probably safe to assume that this article is very biased and/or innacurate.

What accounts? Ed has been an incredibly valuable board member and contributor to PanTerra Networks. He has a wealth of business accumen and we'll luck to have him on our board. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.132.0.75 (talk) 02:55, 16 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I guess someone has never read "In Search of Stupidity," by Rick Chapman (either the 1st or 2nd editions), which detail Esber's epic failings in marvelous detail. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.230.177.44 (talk) 16:36, 4 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Ed Esber recruited me from Radius, where I ran product marketing, to join Creative and run the multimedia upgrade kit business (MMUK). The MMUK business grew 1500% the first 2 years and our biggest problem was sourcing enough CD drives to keep manufacturing flowing. I worked directly for Ed and his marketing insight and guidance was crucial to our success and Creative's overall success in the US. Saying Ed was responsible for A-T's demise is ridiculous. A significant number of Taterheads followed Ed to Creative Labs. 06:25, 16 February 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Rbuchanan (talk • contribs)

With all due respect. Ruin is way overstated. The comment at the top is inappropriate. The company grew from $40M to over $300M during my tenure. It was then sold to Borland for a large profit to the shareholders. The board prevented several great mergers. ---- Ed Esber

The moment Ed Esber dies, this article will be edited to reflect reality instead of his peacocking and there will be no one to revert back to the present fantasy "I'm amazing" article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.230.177.44 (talk) 17:44, 19 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Ed Esber, This Isn't Your Brochure

I edited this a couple years back, and I see Esber has returned to remove anything negative and copy/paste his peacocking. I edited Ashton-Tate today, referencing material in a popular and high-regarded book on marketing, with full refs and citations. Ed, if you continue editing and removing this article, I'll refer the matter to the WP admins and have it locked. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.230.177.44 (talk) 19:24, 4 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Observation

This article is an example of how Wikipedia is not managed any more, but just random and incorrect items. It is well known in the industry and literature that Esber was one of the most hated figures in personal computers, and I looked up Chapman's book and it says "The key to Ashton-Tate's downfall lay in Esber's idiotic mishandling of the dBASE development community" on page 73. It also says on page 80 "Esber apparently didn't realize that as he was making himself public enemy number one with every dBASE developer and programmer on Earth". Maybe Esber is editing this page because he knows all these. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sky is big, Emperor far away (talk • contribs) 22:11, 14 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I saw that Esber came back and deleted references to Chapman's book In Search of Stupidity that says too many things about him... This whole thing is turning into a joke. I added sources from Accidental Empires now. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sky is big, Emperor far away (talk • contribs) 21:45, 17 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Personal memorial

I think the In Search of Stupidity book, the Accidental Empires book [1] ans LA Times article [2] all say the same things, by and large:

Esber was a marketing person who alienated the technical crowd inside and outside the company. The Ashton Tate chief scientist said it in the Accidental Empires link.

He did not understand the technology. What I did not know was that he took his first dBASE programming lesson the week after he was fired, according to Accidental Empires.

The dBASE IV product died as a result of neglect, and the company had to be sold.

Someone should edit the article to that effect. He is just building a memorial to himself here.

Ashton Tate

To Sky is big. Emperor far away.

Sir,

I wish you would identify yourself and your relationship to Ashton Tate and me. You sound very angry on your comments and posts. If I wronged you somehow in the past, I am unaware of it, since I don't know who you are.

If you want to characterize my seven year tenure at Ashton Tate from two books that contain opinions (opinions by the way that are not irrational from the outside) that is your right and I respect that right. There are many inaccuracies in both books. I have posted many articles on my website www.edesber.com both good and bad, people can make their own opinion.

I have left your edits largely intact even though they only represent opinions and part of my Ashton Tate experience. This event happened over 25 years ago. Time to get over it. I fully admit I was fired by the board, while we may disagree over the reasons and/or the timing. I edited the website with accuracy, no pea-cocking or exaggeration.

Please tamp down the animus and let's not keep going back and forth. Please call me, email me or phone me anytime. Back and forth emails are hard to have a respectful conversation and possibly resolve different perceptions. I recently reached out to David Chapman and we chatted by phone and will have further dialogue. We can do the same, rather than try to argue it out over a Wikipedia website.

All the best. Respectfully, Ed Esber — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:681:4300:2FD1:5984:7920:9EB0:BB0B (talk) 09:29, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

First, I do not even know why I bother with this when on vacation. But FYI: I will not call or email you. You never did me any harm, we have never met or spoken, I never worked at AT. But over the years, you have been the subject of some F Troop type entertainment, unlike Jim Manzi who was respected. That was why I was surprised to see the puffery on your page.

I had a few friends who were computer magazine editors and over the years as we had a few beers, there were all kinds of sad jokes about you as the supposed leader of one of the big 3, Ashton Tate, Lotus and Microsoft. So I have had a few laughs, but people seemed sad that you ran that ship into the sand. Example jokes that gave the editor's impression:

You were supposed to give a silver cup to Wayne Ratliff to make up and the joke was: Will there be a subpoena in the cup? You were seen as too harsh and were suing too many people.

Another one said that you went to license software from some company and the fellow was surprised that you had much more interest in the price of condominiums cross the bay as personal invstments than in AT business.

And offering like a million dollar bonus to dBASE developers with a deadline was a big mistake. That was what killed dBASE IV they said, as developers rushed and produced garbage code.

So I will not call you, because you are just an old irrelevant memory, and just subject of jokes. So you should stop puffery. Do you see any puffery on Manzi's page? None. He was a class act.

Now, come clean and tell us, for we do not know. How did George Tate really go away? The unconfirmed item to your credit, and the only "good thing" I heard is that unlike most of the AT crowd you were not an all day party type and were clean and sober. The only one standing up after the Tate era. So there was some good news, but not much. I had not heard of Chapman's book until a few days ago, when I looked on this page, but it seemed accurate. Anyway, I am on vacaion now, so good luck and stop puffery. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sky,Emperetc (talk • contribs) 16:27, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Both of the editors above are asked to read WP:TALK and WP:NOTFORUM and to respect Wikipedia's policy that article "Talk pages are not for general discussion about the subject of the article" but are only for discussions about improving the associated article. While I recognize that some of the conversation has been about the use and/or removal of certain sources and sourced content from this article, the questions posed above indicate that this discussion could quickly veer away from anything that would lead to improvement here. Please find another venue for this discussion. General Ization ^Talk 16:41, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Esber Response

WOW, what an outpouring Sky. On Jim Manzi's site his was just sanitized by the same reviewer that simplified mine. All the best on your vacation, sorry for interrupting it. Have a good life.

Ed Esber — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:681:4300:2FD1:5984:7920:9EB0:BB0B (talk) 18:28, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]