Talk:Burayr ibn Khudayr al-Hamdani

Tags

I rewrote the article and deleted part of the text according to WP:PEACOCK policy. I think the article is suitable and we can remove tags.Saff V. (talk) 13:23, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

Nothing in the article indicates the subject was notable. Edward321 (talk) 00:17, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

@Edward321: Sources of article confirm and indicate the subject is notable not text of article.Saff V. (talk) 12:26, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

If there are sources that provide information showing the subject's notability, then please post that information on the page. Edward321 (talk) 14:39, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

Self-published

@FreeatlastChitchat: 1. Why the Nafasul Mahmoom book is self published? Also, main source of this website is Nafasul Mahmoom book. 2. Why this website and its article is self published?Saff V. (talk) 10:56, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

@Saff V.: It is "self published" because it was not published by a reputable publishing house. They just wrote the book and got it published themselves. Same with the website, it is unreliable. You should read the essay at WP:RS you will understand. Regards FreeatlastChitchat (talk) 11:08, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

@FreeatlastChitchat: Please explain more about this website that why is self published and unreliable?Saff V. (talk) 11:20, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

@Saff V.: it is unreliable because it published Shi'ite propaganda/hagiography without fact checking. I think the front page of the website is very clear indication of this unreliability. You can just click their "About us" section to see this kind shenanigans, Our Imam this and Our Imam that. Maulana this did that and Maulana Ble bleh said that. Regards FreeatlastChitchat (talk) 11:28, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

• @FreeatlastChitchat: Your answers to my questions are wrong and not neutral. Abbas Qumi was born in 1877 and died in 1940 and is old Islamic writer. You said: "They just wrote the book and got it published themselves." It means that Abbas Qumi has publication company and published his books. Mr or Miss attention: Nafasul Mahmoom book is published by many publication such as this one and this one. Also, You must first propose your edit in the talk page and then edit the article. I think that you like edit war. I want ask my question from another user until you understand. Sa.vakilian Is Nafasul Mahmoom book self published? Also, what about FreeatlastChitchat's answer (It is "self published" because it was not published by a reputable publishing house. They just wrote the book and got it published themselves) to this question?Saff V. (talk) 12:10, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
• @Sa.vakilian: Also what is your idea about this website? FreeatlastChitchat said:"it is unreliable because it published Shi'ite propaganda/hagiography without fact checking. I think the front page of the website is very clear indication of this unreliability. You can just click their "About us" section to see this kind shenanigans, Our Imam this and Our Imam that. Maulana this did that and Maulana Ble bleh said that."Saff V. (talk) 12:15, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
• @MezzoMezzo: What is your idea about FreeatlastChitchat's answers?Saff V. (talk) 12:21, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

@Saff V.: Bringing in editors who share your POV is considered bad manners by some, stupid by others and downright bad faith by almost all other editors. This is not the first time you have done this so please refrain from doing this, AGF has its limits. Secondly try to understand Wikipedia policies. Asking for explanation after explanation hints at competency issues, which you already have some of. Regards FreeatlastChitchat (talk) 12:52, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

• @FreeatlastChitchat: I am not here to support Saff V. I just write my idea and you can accept or refuse it based on Wiki policies. Nafasul Mahmoom is not a self-published, but a Shia source. It can be used as a reliable source for Shia POV based on this guideline. It has been published by several publishers such as [1], [2] and [3] Even if, it is "Shi'ite propaganda/hagiography", we can use it to describe Shia POV.--Seyyed(t-c) 09:40, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
• It is not a self-published source.-- Toddy1 (talk) 20:35, 1 December 2015 (UTC)

@ Toddy1 Can you point out which of the sources I deleted was not self published? And feel free to re-add the text from that source. FreeatlastChitchat (talk) 03:07, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

Please do not re-add. The citation does not give the page numbers, and the URL is to a different edition than the ISBN - this difference is significant. There are at least five versions all with different numbers of pages, which is not encouraging.

Nafasul Mahmoom , by Shaikh Abbas Qummi, cannot literally have been self-published, because it was was published after the author's death in 1940 AD. However, the publication status is murky. Versions (2)-(4) of the book are produced by CreateSpace Independent Publishing Platform, which is a part of Amazon whose business is self-publishing of books.

1. Nafasul Mahmoom, by Haj Sheikh Abbas Gummi, published 2005 (not clear who by), ASIN: B003FZF19W, 496 pages.
2. Nafasul Mahmoom: Relating to the Heart Rending Tragedy of Karbala, by Shaikh Abbas al-Qummi and Yasin Publications, published by CreateSpace Independent Publishing Platform, 10 August 2014, ISBN-10: 1500796786, ISBN-13: 978-1500796785, 652 pages.
3. Nafasul Mahmoom, by Shaikh Abbas Qummi, "distributed by Talee", pub CreateSpace Independent Publishing Platform, 26 Sept. 2014, ISBN-10: 1502504065, ISBN-13: 978-1502504067, 584 pages.
4. Nafasul Mahmoom: Relating to the Heart Rending Tragedy of Karbala, by Shaykh Abbas Qummi, " distributed by Ahlulbayt Organization", published by CreateSpace Independent Publishing Platform, 14 November 2015, ISBN-10: 1519290357, ISBN-13: 978-1519290359, 376 pages.
5. Nafasul Mahmoom, by Shaikh Abbas Qummi, published by JAC Developer, 598 pages.

-- Toddy1 (talk) 06:56, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

If someone gave proper citations, including page number and was clear which edition the citation referred to, it would be a reliable to describe the Shia POV. However the citation would need to make it clear that there were other versions with significantly different pagination.-- Toddy1 (talk) 07:01, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

WP:USERGENERATED says "Self-published material may sometimes be acceptable when its author is an established expert whose work in the relevant field has been published by reliable third-party publications. Self-published information should never be used as a third-party source about another living person, even if the author is a well-known professional researcher or writer; see WP:BLP#Reliable sources." Shaikh Abbas Qummi was an established expert, and everyone who participated in the Battle of Karbala is dead now.-- Toddy1 (talk) 07:09, 2 December 2015 (UTC)