Talk:Austin A40 Farina

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Dubious claims about Australian production

The A40 "Farina" two-door hatchback Austin was neither manufactured, assembled nor imported and marketed in Australia. Eregli bob (talk) 14:29, 12 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

"Australian production" is not a sub-section under the "Mark II" heading and the claims do not relate to the Mark II. Both simply relate to Australian production of the A40 Farina. I have therefore removed the "citation needed" templates. GTHO (talk) 11:06, 13 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

You are confused. Various versions of the four-door A55 Austin Cambridge/Morris/Wolseley "Farina" models were produced in Australia between about 1960 and 1965, based on the corresponding generation of badge-engineered 4-door family car produced in England between 1959 and about 1967. This included the six-cylinder versions which were unique to Australia. This was a completely different series of cars to the 1957-1964 two-door A40 "Farina" model produced in Britain. During the period of the A40 Farina production in Britain, the Australian subsidiary was manufacturing the Morris Minor, Austin Lancer and Morris Major Elite. The A40 Farina was never manufactured in Australia nor was it imported and sold there. Neither of the references you cite actually refer to the Austin A40 Farina. You may be confused because the 1959-1967 class of larger, four-door cars were also nicknamed Farina, after the Italian stylist. I've therefore removed the section about Australia completely, because it is bogus.Eregli bob (talk) 09:04, 16 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The source says "We had the market covered, we thought, with the Morris Minor 1000, Austin A40 Farina, Morris Major II, Austin Lancer II, Austin A60, Morris Oxford V, and Wolseley 15/60, all locally assembled with a very high Australian content." Also here http://www.austinmemories.com/page8/page15/page15.html -->Typ932 ^T·C 14:21, 16 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

It's hard to disentangle what the BMC salesmen told the press (which can easily find its way onto the sources) from what actually got locally assembled and (presumably) sold. The story of BMC in Australia certainly had its share of undelivered promises. But with this it could be relatively easy to check out an old motoring magazine from the late 1950s/early 1960s and see if they actually list the thing with a price inside the back cover. There must be someone contributing who is (1) in Australia, (2) old enough (3) enthusiastic about cars and (4) hasn't yet trashed the motoring magazines from his youth. Well, I thought it worthwhile to spell out the possibility. Otherwise those old motor mags tend to turn up for sale on stands at "classic car" shows here in England generally at ridiculous prices. I imagine it's the same in Aus, and you wouldn't necessarily have to buy it in order to take a quick look..... Regards Charles01 (talk) 14:38, 16 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Well indeed. I spent most the 1960's Saturday mornings washing the cars at my uncle's BMC dealership in Sydney, and I never saw one of these cars until I went to England and they were everywhere. In fact it was just about the only car on the English roads that I had never seen in Australia. I could also point out this reference http://trove.nla.gov.au/work/153945403?q=austin+a40&c=picture which suggests that it was fully imported in Australia - and possibly in very small numbers.Eregli bob (talk) 06:17, 18 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The can be little doubt that the A40 was marketed in Australia. The Buyer's Guide in the January 1 1960 edition of Australian Motor Manual magazine lists Austin A40, 948cc, £925. New Car Prices in the January 1962 edition of Wheels (another Australian motoring magazine) lists Austin A/40 Station Wagon, £925. The October 1959 edition of Wheels magazine contains a BMC advertisment for two Farina models, the A60 and the A40. As both of the references under the Australian production heading in the article clealy refer to Australian production of the Austin A40 Farina, I am undoing the deletion. GTHO (talk) 00:02, 17 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

A related issue is the "local content" thing. From the UK perspective the Australian market was noteworthy for the requirement that (loosely put) to sell a car in Australia, it had to employ a high percentage of local content. I rmember seeing the figure 80% quoted at one stage but (1) I think the figure changed at some stage and (2) I may be thinking of Spain where there was the same local content issue for UK automakers at least before the Kennedy round tarriff cuts.

How do you measure local content? Sheet steel or pressed panels? Hours of labour with 400% (or 40%) overhead applied to the hourly rate used. The cost accountants would have had a field day determining "relevant costs" according to the answer management first came up with. BUT if anyone out there is an expert (or has access to expert sources) on what the local content requirement was, how local content was measured, whether you were permitted to import up to (say) 25 cars of a single model without adhering to the local content requirement.....that would be interesting. On the A40 question here (1) it might give context to the discussion and (2) it might explain why even at the time there was a certain vagueness on what was produced (or "assembled"?) in Aus and what was produced in England. That vagueness could have resulted from genuine ignorance of the rules and their application, or it could have reflected a management reluictance to engage with the issues in public lest someone suggest they'd come up with the wrong answer. Or both. Either way, maybe there's a can of (by now near-fossilised) worms waiting to be opened up. Regards Charles01 (talk) 06:57, 18 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

On "Trove" can be located a lot of advertising, complete with colour photos, from the Australian Woman's weekly of the period. There are lots of photos of the A40 Devon (c.1949-1953), the A40 Somerset(1954-1955), the A40/A50/A55 Cambridge(1955-1958), the A55/A60 new Cambridge(1959+), the A30/A35 bubble car, Austin Freeway and the Austin Lancer. There's also lots of ads for the Morris Minor, Morris Oxford, Morris Isis, Morris Marshall, Morris Major, new Morris Oxford and new Morris 850 ( early mini ) and Morris 1100. Advertising for the Austin A40 Farina notably absent. Curiously there is a picture of an A40 as a prize for some kind of raffle, here http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/51600936 . In a lifetime of visiting classic car shows and rallies and field days, I have seen precisely 2 of these cars in Australia, and I know that one was privately imported by the owner when he moved from England. It is also interesting that the member's cars photo gallery at the Austin A40 car club website features precisely zero examples of the A40 Farina model ( the reference in the club's name is to the much earlier A40 mid-size models ).

I remain unconvinced on this issue. I will do some research on the microfilms of the Sydney Morning Herald which are not yet online after 1954.Eregli bob (talk) 07:36, 18 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Farina

I have never seen Farina’s name on the Mkl or Mkll or, other than in passing, any of the sales literature. Was it officially called a Farina or is that just common usage to save confusion with the previous Devon/Somerset design? 2A00:23C7:F682:8100:6DF0:D9B2:5C85:8176 (talk) 14:20, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]