Talk:Attempted assassination of Donald Trump in Pennsylvania

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Attempted assassination of Donald Trump in Pennsylvania article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10: 3 months

This article is written in American English, which has its own spelling conventions (color, defense, traveled) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus.

The contentious topics procedure applies to this page. This page is related to post-1992 politics of the United States and closely related people, which has been designated as a contentious topic.

Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be blocked or restricted by an administrator. Editors are advised to familiarise themselves with the contentious topics procedures before editing this page.

While the biographies of living persons policy does not apply directly to the subject of this article, it may contain material that relates to living persons, such as friends and family of persons no longer living, or living persons involved in the subject matter. Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material about living persons must be removed immediately. If such material is re-inserted repeatedly, or if there are other concerns related to this policy, please see this noticeboard.

Crime and Criminal Biography High‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Crime and Criminal Biography articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Crime and Criminal BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyCrime-related articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Death Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Death, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Death on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.DeathWikipedia:WikiProject DeathTemplate:WikiProject DeathDeath articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Pennsylvania Low‑importance

	Pennsylvania portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Pennsylvania, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Pennsylvania on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PennsylvaniaWikipedia:WikiProject PennsylvaniaTemplate:WikiProject PennsylvaniaPennsylvania articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Pittsburgh Mid‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Pittsburgh, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Pittsburgh and its metropolitan area on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PittsburghWikipedia:WikiProject PittsburghTemplate:WikiProject PittsburghPittsburgh articles
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.

Politics: American Mid‑importance

	Politics portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Politics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of politics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PoliticsWikipedia:WikiProject PoliticsTemplate:WikiProject Politicspolitics articles
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by American politics task force (assessed as Mid-importance).

United States: Presidential elections / History Mid‑importance

	United States portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject United States, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the United States of America on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions. Template Usage Articles Requested! Become a Member Project Talk Alerts United StatesWikipedia:WikiProject United StatesTemplate:WikiProject United StatesUnited States articles
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by WikiProject U.S. presidential elections (assessed as Mid-importance).
	This article is supported by WikiProject U.S. history (assessed as Mid-importance).

United States Presidents: Donald Trump Mid‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject United States Presidents, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of United States Presidents on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.United States PresidentsWikipedia:WikiProject United States PresidentsTemplate:WikiProject United States PresidentsUnited States Presidents articles
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the importance scale.
	This article is supported by the Donald Trump task force.

This article has previously been nominated to be moved. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination.

Discussions:

Moved, 13 July 2024, from 2024 shooting at a Donald Trump rally to Attempted assassination of Donald Trump, see discussion.
Not moved, 14 July 2024, from Attempted assassination of Donald Trump to 2024 Attempted assassination of Donald Trump, see discussion.
Moved, 15 September 2024, from Attempted assassination of Donald Trump to Attempted assassination of Donald Trump in Pennsylvania, see discussion.

Page history

A news item involving Attempted assassination of Donald Trump in Pennsylvania was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the In the news section on 14 July 2024.

Wikipedia

This article has been viewed enough times in a single week to appear in the Top 25 Report. The week in which this happened:

July 14 to 20, 2024

Section sizes

Section size for Attempted assassination of Donald Trump in Pennsylvania (22 sections)
Section name	Byte count	Section total
(Top)	14,475	14,475
Background	7,829	15,475
Security arrangements	7,646	7,646
Shooting	38,457	50,915
Timeline	12,458	12,458
Victims	9,529	9,529
Perpetrator	15,413	15,413
Aftermath	16,316	65,326
Investigation	18,449	24,619
Motive	6,170	6,170
Criticism of security arrangements	14,694	14,694
Photographs	9,697	9,697
Reactions	5,788	77,088
Domestic	24,774	24,774
International	15,041	15,041
Online	10,573	10,573
Misinformation and conspiracy theories	16,697	16,697
Entertainment	4,215	4,215
See also	425	425
Notes	23	23
References	30	30
External links	2,027	2,027
Total	250,726	250,726

2nd proposal on adding mass shooting categories

Given that time has passed since my initial request some months ago, I'd like to bring up this subject again. Speaking strictly on facts, this event can be considered a mass shooting according to several definitions (which are utilised across Wikipedia), including the definitions set by the Gun Violence Archive, Vox, and the Stanford University MSA Data Project. More importantly, since the shooting, several reliable sources have, one way or another, referred to this event a mass shooting, or referred to Crooks as a mass shooter. See the contents of the following:

The Attempt to Assassinate Trump Was Also a Mass Shooting | The Trace

Criminologist: Shooting at Trump rally yet another reason to focus on assault weapons | The Palm Beach Post

Trump Rally Attack Was PA’s 19th Mass Shooting of 2024 | CeaseFirePA

Trump is now a member of the mass shooting survivor’s club – will it change anything? | The Guardian

Trump describes assassination attempt in speech accepting GOP presidential nomination | Nebraska Examiner

Trump rally gunman Thomas Crooks in rare class among high-profile shooters | Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

Tree may have blocked sniper team's view of Trump rally gunman, maps show | CBS News (categorised as a 'mass shooting' article)

'He was a true hero:' PA man shares his attempt to help father killed in Trump shooting | The Beaver County Times

Trump Agrees to FBI Interview in Attempted Assassination Investigation | The New York Times

Trump Rally Shooter Had Interest in Violence Since 2019, FBI Analysis Shows | The New York Times

This is not every article, but I think this is more than enough to allow categories such as Category:Mass shootings in the United States. These articles could be inserted into the article for referencing if people agree with this proposal. Previous discussions of this concept were met with opposition due to lack of reliable sources calling this event a mass shooting, so I compiled this small list of a variety of global, national and local news sources which do so. It is worth noting that this event is already classified as a mass shooting on the article List of mass shootings in the United States in 2024. Additionally, within this article, under Motive, it is already stated that this shooting fits some definitions of a mass shooting.

In other discussions of this nature, it has been argued that Crooks was likely only targeting Trump, so categorising the event as a 'mass shooting' is inappropriate, but this would be original research (WP:OR) as Crooks' entire motives and intentions have not been confirmed. Macxcxz (talk) 02:34, 25 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 31 October 2024

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Change: A previous attempt at violence toward Trump during one of his rallies happened in 2016, when a man attempted to grab a security officer's gun at a rally outside of Las Vegas.[27]

To:

A previous attempt at violence toward Trump during one of his rallies happened in 2016, when a man attempted to grab a police officer's gun at a rally outside of Las Vegas.[27]

Source is the in the linked (27) news article. The "security" officer was in fact a Las Vegas Metropolitan Police officer, on duty providing assistance to the Secret Service. 72.5.34.1 (talk) 09:53, 31 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Accepted. Macxcxz (talk) 10:03, 31 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Trump being supposedly shot and the FBI report

The lead paragraph currently states that Trump was "shot", based on a RfC. However, that RfC predates the FBI report - currently cited in the article via a NYT article - that states that Trump was either grazed by a bullet or by a fragment thereof i.e. it is unclear whether he was actually shot. While a number of sources use that phrasing, most predate that report. Cortador (talk) 10:49, 5 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I think this depends on your definition of "shot". A bullet was fired at him and hit him - to some extent - so I think 'shot' is appropriate. Macxcxz (talk) 11:32, 5 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This has already been debated ad nauseam. The FBI confirmed that Trump was shot by a bullet, either whole or in part. Any discussion beyond that is useless semantics. "Shot" is completely appropriate:

https://www.britannica.com/dictionary/shoot

"to wound or kill (a person or animal) with a bullet, arrow, etc., that is shot from a weapon"

A bullet fragment is part of a bullet. Just so it's extra clear for you, being grazed by a bullet is a more specific subset of being shot by a bullet i.e. if you were grazed by a bullet, then by definition you were shot by a bullet. MightyLebowski (talk) 01:15, 7 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"Ketchup packet" claims

Yes, I am actually bringing this up because it's actually "a thing" which has been an issue since the attempt. There are several reliable sources which have brought it up in order to debunk the ridiculousness of it:

Doctored photo of Trump assassination attempt fuels baseless 'staged' claims

Why Conspiracy Theories Spread on the Left and Right After the Assassination Attempt on Trump

Ahead of U.S. polls, Liberals stir the pot with conspiracy theories

How BlueAnon conspiracy theories are gaining momentum since the assassination attempt on Trump

Trump shooting, one week on

Should this be included? 216.168.91.102 (talk) 21:57, 8 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Close call, but I don't think so. The article already says "False claims included that the shooting and blood on Trump were faked; that crisis actors were used..." in the "Misinformation and conspiracy theories" section. After checking out the ketchup packet photo in question (which is hilarious) I find it hard to believe anyone took it seriously... this seems to be about just another internet meme. Marcus Markup (talk) 06:24, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

As with the above, were already cover false claims. Slatersteven (talk) 10:52, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]