Talk:Anishinaabe traditional beliefs

Reference to "settler-colonial" narratives

Suggesting to remove this non-sequitur reference to "settler-colonial narratives":

"This is different from many settler colonial narratives which usually clearly define story characters as good or bad."

Assuming that Hobomok would be opposed to this as well.

There are the same problems here as with the other reference to "settler-colonial" culture in this article:

1. This is an article about Anishinaabe culture, not "settler-colonial" culture

2. The cited source 12, a book, which I was able to search on Google books preview, covers Anishinaabe traditional stories, and makes no reference to "settler-colonial" literature. The relevant quote to the citation is:

"Finally, in Genesis, the post-garden world we inherit is decidedly martial in nature, a world at war -- God vs. the Devil, humans vs. the elemnets. Or to put things into corporate parlance, competitive. In our Native story, the world is at peace, and the pivotal concern is not with the ascendancy of good over evil but with the issue of balance."

It does make reference to Judeo-Christian creation myth and the concept of Christian Good_and_evil but only stops there in the book of Genesis, it does not describe any other "settler colonial narratives".

3. "Settler colonial" narratives do not usually clearly define story characters as good or bad. Whether you're talking about Judeo-Christian religious traditions, or European literature, or American literature, which I think would cover all the possibilities of "settler colonial narratives", correct me if I'm wrong.

This could be reworded to compare the Anishinaabe tradition to Judeo-Christian tradition specifically, like the source does, instead of vague, ambiguous, and arguably false "settler-colonial narratives", but why should Judeo-Christian traditions be discussed in this article about Anishinaabe traditional beliefs? The sentence should just be removed. The source should probably be cited for the relevant information in the preceding sentence. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.190.52.152 (talk) 04:48, 7 January 2022 (UTC)

Reference to "settler-colonialist" culture in this article about Anishinaabe traditional beliefs

Suggesting to remove the non-sequitur about settler-colonial culture not valuing oral tradition:

"Oral storytelling is often considered unimportant in settler colonial society;"

Hobomok undid the change.

There are several problems with this claim:

1. This is an article about Anishinaabe culture, not "settler-colonial" culture.

2. The cited source 8 does not cover the topic of settler-colonial oral tradition, it covers Anishinaabe culture. Here is its abstract:

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs10551-013-1790-3

3. "settler-colonial" society has at least as much value for oral traditions as any other culture on the planet. It's very easy to find examples of this, for example Paul Bunyan.

This sentence just needs to be removed, it's unrelated to the article topic, it is not cited, and it's factually incorrect. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.190.52.152 (talk) 04:04, 7 January 2022 (UTC)

Untitled

This page is titled to indicate that it's about mythology, but the first paragraph is about the people. That could use some cleanup. -Harmil 17:29, 23 September 2005 (UTC)

Some other things to include

This is partly just a note to myself since I need to go to bed but I'll forget this otherwise:

• Dawn Society Expanded a bit more with a link to the main articleCJLippert (talk) 16:45, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
• Misaabe
• More on the manitous Expanded a bit more, but now contains a link to the main article. CJLippert (talk) 23:56, 30 June 2008 (UTC)
• The Great Flood story and the recreation of the earth on Turtle's back
• More on the origin and purpose of the Midewiwin Expanded a bit more, but now contains a link to the main article. CJLippert (talk) 15:52, 30 June 2008 (UTC)
• The importance of asemaa (?) Expanded a bit more; maybe should add "Ceremonial Use" section in the Tobacco article. CJLippert (talk) 23:56, 30 June 2008 (UTC)
• Those...those guys who yelled when nibiinaabeg were around, to warn people? Johnston mentions them a few times, I think. I'll have to check (and see what their name is)
• Add back in stuff on the significance of the four directions (?)
• Better description of Nookomis and of "Mother Earth"
• Bagwajiwinini(wag?) (I'm not clear on who he/they is/are, though)

--Miskwito 06:37, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Follow-Up

Whis is Wabun redirected here? Please clarify Goldenrowley 02:54, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

Waaban is the East(-wind). Miskwito above had mentioned about adding back in the four wind directions. It seems we have not gotten back to that, other than the Gaa-biboonikaan and the E-bangishimog. So, I guess we need to work on both Waaban and Zhaawanong still, and start an article for E-bangishimog. CJLippert 13:19, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

Please avoid pan-Indianism with ideas about "4 Sacred Medicines" and such. Ever medicine is sacred and there are thousands. These ideas are erroneous and most often the result of people like Eddie Benton just making things up for their own posterity. Benton has perverted the Midewewin and real, old, traditional Midewewin will have nothing to do with him. White Sage is not Native to any Anishinabek territory, save for the Plains Ojibway and obviously, was only used after their encounters with the Dakota. The use of Sage to smudge is an error many "born again" Indians make as well as burning it in an Abalone shell which is not native to any Anishinabek territory either. West coast elders will tell you the shell is not to be burned in as it is for water ceremonies.. Cedar and Sweetgrass were the most commonly used in any "smudging" and it did not need to be ceremonial in Nature.

The Jiisikiwinini is MUCH more than just about the "shaking tent" and any information you find outside of Basil Johnston's vague description should be questioned. It is not discussed publicly like most medicine practices and encompasses far more than just the one ceremony that you described. that's all I will say. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.226.103.191 (talk) 20:03, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

Meshekenabek

• - Anyone have info on "Meshekenabek" carried off Nanobozho's cousin into a deep lake? --108.170.134.154 (talk) 03:13, 8 August 2015 (UTC)

• - The Seven Grandfathers--108.170.134.154 (talk) 05:22, 8 August 2015 (UTC)

• - Chibiabos--108.170.134.154 (talk) 05:22, 8 August 2015 (UTC)