Talk:Alfred Wegener/Archive 1

Archive 1

Edit by anon

Does anyone know whether [http://wiki.riteme.site/w/index.php?title=Ajkdfjj lfred_Wegener&diff=next&oldid=86327757 this edit] is correct? JoshuaZ 02:16, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

Reverted and supplied NASA ref for 29227 Wegener. Vsmith 02:39, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

Frank Bursley Taylor

Replaced the following unsourced bit about Frank Taylor, Taylor did publish on continental drift prior to 1912, but where is the evidence that Wegener was aware of it?

Wegener happened to pick up an incredibly obscure paper in the GSA (Geological Society of America) (v. 21, p. 179–226) by an amateur American author named Frank Bursley Taylor. This was seemingly the first published reference to the theory of continental drift (although Bursley had actually publicy unveiled his theory at the GSA Annual Meeting in Baltimore, Maryland, on Dec. 29, 1908). ... Reading Taylor's paper crystallised these thoughts into the theory...

The Taylor bit was added by an anon on 21 Nov. I reverted that portion to the prior edit and included a source. It can be re-entered if a source is provided. Vsmith 03:48, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

I have added info about Taylor's work w/ refs to the Continental drift page. Vsmith 04:17, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Roberto Mantovani

Dear All Please note that Roberto Mantovani first book in both french and italian on Plate Tectonic was written in 1889 when Alfred "Wangner" was 9 years old !!! eheheh its a comedy !! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.151.66.41 (talk) 15:31, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Wegener was to become a prominent follower of the idea of Roberto Mantovani that spend his life proliferating Mantovanis ideas, its ironic that no many geoscientists remembers the work of the great Mantovani, and that today geologists and geophysicists are in absolute darkness on who did what !!! Francesco Fucilla 86.151.66.41 00:10, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

I attempted to edit Wegener history page to reflect the truth as to His work on continental drift and place the following letter to the discussion page But to my regret both were removed. Could you be so kind to tell me why !!?? ... Francesco fucilla 86.142.77.154 19:32, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

I agree with Vsmith's comment in his edit of 14:24, 15 September 2007. The above statement, and what followed, appears to be strongly POV, and so I reduced its size where "..." appears. The full text is, of course, accessible through this page's history tab. -- One way to handle such contentious points is to cite respected professional journals in which historians of science have investigated and debated the matter. Do such publications exist related to Wegener's development of continental drift? I do note that Wikipedia's continental drift article covers some matters related to Wegener and Mantovani. -- Astrochemist (talk) 00:11, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Leaving Wegener

The Wegener article is an interesting one, but my expertise is not in this particular area and my contributions have been mainly the photo, some copy editing, and vandal chasing. In the future I will leave the article to other editors. Best wishes to all. -- Astrochemist (talk) 13:27, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Forgot to remove this one from my watchlist. Unfortunately, Wegener's page seems to be very attractive to vandals. Good luck in protecting it, and best wishes with its editing. -- Astrochemist (talk) 16:07, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

hi alfred you rock —Preceding unsigned comment added by 125.239.105.242 (talk) 19:45, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Discrepancy with the Pangaea article over the origin of the Pangaea name

This article states

In 1915, in The Origin of Continents and Oceans (Die Entstehung der Kontinente und Ozeane), Wegener published the theory that there had once been a giant continent, he named "Pangaea" (meaning "All-Lands" or "All-Earth")

while the Pangaea article states

The name was coined in the scientific discussion of Alfred Wegener's theory of continental drift. In his book "The Origin of Continents and Oceans" (Die Entstehung der Kontinente und Ozeane) he postulated that all the continents had at one time formed a single supercontinent which he called the "Urkontinent", before later breaking up and drifting to their present locations. The term Pangaea appeared in 1928 during a symposium to discuss Alfred Wegener's theory. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 144.136.83.19 (talk) 22:17, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

• Philip Kearey, Keith A. Klepeis, Frederik J. Vine (2009). Global tectonics (3 ed.). Wiley-Blackwell. p. 482. ISBN 978-1-4051-0777-8. Wegener termed this continental assembly Pangea (literally "all the Earth") although we currently prefer to think in terms of A. du Toit's idea of it being made up of two supercontinents (du Toit, 1937){{cite book}}: CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (link)
• Wegener, Alfred (1929). Die Entstehung der Kontinente und Ozeane (4 ed.). Braunschweig: Friedrich Vieweg & Sohn Akt. Ges. ISBN 3443010563.
  • The book uses only "Urkontinent", German Wikipedia states that Wegener only used "Urkontinent".
• W.A.J.M. van Waterschoot van der Gracht, Bailey Willis, Rollin T. Chamberlin, John Joly, G.A.F. Molengraaff, J.W. Gregory, Alfred Wegener, Charles Schuchert, Chester R. Longwell, Frank Bursley Taylor, William Bowie, David White, Joseph T. Singewald, Jr., and Edward W. Berry (1928). W.A.J.M. van Waterschoot van der Gracht (ed.). Theory of Continental Drift: a symposium on the origin and movement of land masses both intercontinental and intracontinental as proposed by Alfred Wegener, A Symposium of the American Association of Petroleum Geologists (AAPG, 1926). Tulsa, OK. p. 240.{{cite book}}: CS1 maint: location missing publisher (link) CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (link)
  • German Wikipedia states that only the conference of 1926 and its published work of 1928 uses Pangea. Wegener is one of the 14 authors.
• In a way the Greek Pangea is equivalent to the German Urkontinent (origin of the continents).
• --Chris.urs-o (talk) 05:49, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

Xredna (talk) 18:28, 30 April 2011 (UTC) I don't know if this type of information becomes too remote from the subject, but wegenr was the father-in-law of Heinrich harrer that undertook the first successful ascent of the north face of mount eiger in 1938. Out of consideration for Frau else wegener, widowed eight years earlier he asked his mother in laws permission to undertake the venture. All this based on Harrer's book "The White spider"

Circumstantial evidence

I have deleted the perjorative refernece to "circumstantial evidence". All geological evidence about past earth conditions is circumstantial since there were no eye-witnesses to oberve what was happening! The editor who used the term seemed unaware of the meaning of the term and its applicability in this context.Peterlewis (talk) 18:46, 2 September 2011 (UTC)

Was the body found or not?

The text says, "Wegener's body was found buried in a sleeping bag cover six months later on May 12, 1931..."

In the same paragraph is written, "It is unlikely Wegener or Villumsens bodies will ever be recovered as it is estimated that due to accumulation of ice...."

So which is? Was the body in a sleeping bag or or not found?68.81.151.62 (talk) 15:53, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

Both are true since Wegener's body was reburied in the ice after its discovery, and Villumsens was not discovered at all. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ClareDudman (talk • contribs) 09:58, 28 April 2012 (UTC)

Project Geology: This article of "Mid-importance" !?

Surely Wegener is of supreme importance for geology/geologists? --TraceyR (talk) 13:35, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

The only geologist to make it into the 'high' importance category is Charles Lyell. Wegener is in good company with William Smith (geologist) and James Hutton. Mikenorton (talk) 13:48, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Then I suggest that Wegener's importance be re-assessed by the project. His contributions were 'ground-breaking'! --TraceyR (talk) 23:55, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

No more so than Hutton's. By all means raise this issue at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Geology, perhaps the importance of all the geologists should be re-assessed. Mikenorton (talk) 08:08, 30 January 2010 (UTC)

I agree with TraceyR - his ideas have changed the way we see our world. The idea that the continents can drift was revolutionary. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ClareDudman (talk • contribs) 10:03, 28 April 2012 (UTC)

Mid-importance is just for the Project Geology internal article priority list, there are very few editors anyway. Biographies are less important than geology. Wegener had success with the help of Marcel Alexandre Bertrand, Hans Schardt, Reginald Aldworth Daly, Otto Ampferer, Émile Argand, Arthur Holmes, Alexander du Toit, Robert Schwinner, Alfred Rittmann, Patrick Marshall, Felix Andries Vening Meinesz, later Bruce C. Heezen, Maurice Ewing, Stanley Keith Runcorn, Samuel Warren Carey, Harry Hammond Hess (see Timeline of the development of tectonophysics). He was a meteorologist in a hurry to publish some correlations before going to Greenland to research its weather. In hindsight, his paper had some flaws and he should have waited 3 years before publishing it. He wasn't completely right, but Harold Jeffreys was wrong. The Earth's internal heat generation by radioactive decay wasn't know (Age of the Earth#Early calculations), the Pratt-Hayford isostasy model was wrong, the consequences of the idea of thrust faults wasn't present yet and the idea of subduction wasn't mature. Crystalline structures deform under heat and pressure (Maxwell's equations) and continents are static by the measurement possibilities of the 1940's. The scientific controversy was a ridiculous mess ;) --Chris.urs-o (talk) 15:38, 28 April 2012 (UTC) and --Chris.urs-o (talk) 02:42, 29 April 2012 (UTC)

I've started a discussion over at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Geology#Importance_of_articles_on_famous_geologists - as I don't think that this has ever been considered except on an article by article basis, which means that there are bound to be inconsistencies. Mikenorton (talk) 18:02, 28 April 2012 (UTC)

You put your case well, Chris - but you haven't persuaded me that Wegener belongs at the same importance level as subjects like Duria Antiquior, Philippine Mobile Belt and St. Michael's Cave. I agree that we should remember that no scientist can do it alone; even Newton stood on the shoulders of giants. And yes, science is often messy. And I also agree that the scientists are less important than the science. But it is important to put a human face on science, and Wegener may be the most famous geologist who is famous primarily for geology (consistent with your statistics on page views). Not many biographies should be Top- or High-importance, but Wegener's should be one of them. RockMagnetist (talk) 21:28, 29 April 2012 (UTC)

Thx, the question is, if Lyell, Hutton and Wegener are high importance, who else is too? --Chris.urs-o (talk) 05:03, 30 April 2012 (UTC)

That's a hard question and I'd rather pursue it on the wikiproject talk page. RockMagnetist (talk) 05:22, 30 April 2012 (UTC)

Minor corrections needed

In Postwar period and third expedition, "Wagner presented" should read "Wegener presented", and "included a test an innovative" should read "included a test of an innovative". In Fourth and last expedition, "was to Greenland in 1930" should read, maybe, "to Greenland was in 1930". 200.157.204.20 (talk) 02:24, 1 June 2012 (UTC)

Done. Thanks for pointing them out! RockMagnetist (talk) 04:59, 1 June 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 2 May 2013

"fit together like a jigsaw" should read "fit together like a jigsaw puzzle" A jigsaw is a type of power saw that can be used to make a jigsaw puzzle.156.99.108.1 (talk)

156.99.108.1 (talk) 19:40, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

Done It would look pretty odd if the continents fit together like a jigsaw. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 21:26, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 2 May 2013

"at a time when Germans were starving to death owing to post-war shortages"- I feel that this part of sentence should be removed as inaccurate, bordering on post-war propaganda. No reference is provided for this interpretation. Germany experienced an economic boom following the Dawes loan and any shortages experienced in 1930 would have been a result of the onset of the Great Depression, not post-war austerity. This attitude seems related to the "Germany was treated unfairly and was far too poor to pay reparations" argument that continues to this day.156.99.108.1 (talk)

156.99.108.1 (talk) 19:32, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

I have removed that clause from the sentence but left the remaining part of the sentence alone. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 21:28, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 2 May 2013

"Gondwanaland" in illustration should read "Gondwana", as the linked artcle correctly shows. "Gondwanaland" is an outdated usage.156.99.108.1 (talk)

156.99.108.1 (talk) 19:43, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

Done Minor edit only. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 21:29, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 December 2013

what?? what?? ido is smart — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.98.96.148 (talk) 18:17, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

Familiy, daugthers

Alfred and Else had three daugthers, Hilde (1914-1936), Käte, and Lotte. Käte married Heinrich Harrer, Lotte married Siegfried Uiberreither. 84.187.235.197 (talk) 18:35, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

Refernce to important climate book by Alfred Wegener. Semi-protected edit request on 27 August 2015

Please add the following reference to one of Wegeners most important books (on past climates, essentially an intruction to climate change (paleoclimatology); co-authored with his father-in-law Waldimir Köppen) and soon available (Sept. 28, 2015 as an English-Language Translation + facsimile):

Köppen, W. & Wegener, A. (1924/2015): The Climates of the Geological Past (Die Klimate der geologischen Vorzeit), IX, 657 p. 94 figs., numerous tables, Borntraeger Science Publishers (who published the original in 1924).

93.205.16.62 (talk) 10:01, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

Looks reasonable to me. I'll add it. Geoffrey.landis (talk) 23:20, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Edit Request

The 'see also' section has a link with hair ice as the text but frost flower as the destination. He discovered hair ice, not frost flowers in general, and the more specific page exists so the link just needs to be re-pointed to hair ice. 86.22.77.162 (talk) 01:19, 1 September 2015 (UTC)

Done, thanks. Vsmith (talk) 02:28, 1 September 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 22 September 2015

91.65.195.62 (talk) 07:17, 22 September 2015 (UTC)

Not done: as you have not requested a change.
If you want to suggest a change, please request this in the form "Please replace XXX with YYY" or "Please add ZZZ between PPP and QQQ".
Please also cite reliable sources to back up your request, without which no information should be added to, or changed in, any article. - Arjayay (talk) 07:39, 22 September 2015 (UTC)

New biography

Alfred Wegener: Science, Exploration, and the Theory of Continental Drift by Mott T. Greene, 2015, Johns Hopkins University Press Jodi.a.schneider (talk) 13:56, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 26 January 2016

62.97.244.34 (talk) 07:56, 26 January 2016 (UTC)

Not done: as you have not requested a change.
If you want to suggest a change, please request this in the form "Please replace XXX with YYY" or "Please add ZZZ between PPP and QQQ".
Please also cite reliable sources to back up your request, without which no information should be added to, or changed in, any article. - Arjayay (talk) 08:33, 26 January 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 June 2016

Correcting a linguistic lapse:

At the end of the 'First Greenland expedition and years in Marburg', it says: Petermanns Geographischen Mitteilungen. The title is not quite correct, it should read Petermanns Geographische Mitteilungen, thus without the present final N at the end of the 2nd word. I'm a native speaker, but if that doesn't convince you, you can find my claim backed up at https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petermanns_Geographische_Mitteilungen

200.63.47.32 (talk) 13:00, 11 June 2016 (UTC)

Done Someone used the wrong grammar ending. Thank you! st170e^talk 15:50, 11 June 2016 (UTC)

Citation for quote by Charles Schuchert

Does anyone have a citation for Schuchert's quote in the continental drift section? If not, should we delete it? Natokr (talk) 23:44, 15 December 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 December 2017

he died at 50, not 23 as the article states 2605:A000:C2C8:5900:3DD7:4687:DB03:C917 (talk) 23:17, 11 December 2017 (UTC)

 Not done. Re-read that paragraph, specifically the previous sentence. That text is saying Rasmus Villumsen, not Wegener, died at 23. CityOfSilver 00:03, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

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Copyrighted material

Moved from Wikipedia:Copyright problems

• Alfred Wegener from [1]; a non-copyvio version exists in an earlier edit here. - ℘yrop (talk) 01:02, Dec 8, 2004 (UTC)

• • This is a pretty important entry; his ideas revolutionised the field of geography. Policy on this is "Pages where the most recent edit is a copyright violation, but the previous article was not, should not be deleted. They should be reverted." Accordingly I will revert to the November 23rd (non copyvio) version. -- [[User:Tony Sidaway|Tony Sidaway|Talk]] 13:39, 8 Dec 2004 (UTC)

End moved text

As we now have the ability to undelete revisions selectively, and the copyvio was caught before any other edits were made, I deleted only the offending revisions. Ain't that neat? -- Cyrius|✎ 06:31, 27 Dec 2004 (UTC)

NPOV?

The line "It took more than 50 years for the "consensus" of the scientists to acknowledge a fact that is obvious to every kid who looks at the map of Africa and South America." seems a tad loaded. - Cybren 01:36, 18 Feb 2005 (UTC)

You are quite right. Rewrote a bit to tone down some of the "loaded" material. - Vsmith 03:26, 18 Feb 2005 (UTC)

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Reasons that Wegner Believed in Continental Drift

There are four main facts to prove that continental drift is real. The first is continental fit. This means that the way that the continents are shaped in a way that they fit together like a puzzle. This was Wegner’s first argument to the theory. Wegner stated that the continents would fit coastline to coastline. A more realistic approach, by Sir Edward Bullard in 1965, states that the best fit between these continents would be about 2,000 meters below the continents due to the submerged parts of the places. The next part of Wegner’s evidence is similar mountain ranges and rock sequences. This is proven by the Appalachian Mountain range that makes its way north east into North America. All the Mountain ranges are the same age and have the same type of deformation style. The third area of evidence is from glaciers. In the Paleozoic period there was a large area covered in glaciers in the southern hemisphere. The evidence of the glaciers came from till and striations in the bedrock. All being the same age as that of the northern hemisphere. The final area of fact is fossil evidence. This means that when Wegner went on his Denmark-Greenland expedition scheduled in mid-1912 he was able to find fossils on one continent that matched the same fossils in the same sediment layers on a different continent. This with the previous stated facts all line up the idea that the plates are slowly drifting. This along with the new advancements in geological technology helps us confirm that continental drift is naturally occurring and is going to continue to happen. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kryfayjen (talk • contribs) 22:28, 10 May 2019 (UTC)

References

Semi-protected edit request on 27 April 2021

24.172.206.214 (talk) 14:46, 27 April 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Pupsterlove02 talk • contribs 14:50, 27 April 2021 (UTC)

I think he's referring to the "he had 10 kids" which previously was obscured in the unrelated section "Reasons that Wegner Believed in Continental Drift". But I concur with the "not done"; any edit to add his children would need a WP:RS. TJRC (talk) 17:27, 28 April 2021 (UTC)

Discrepancy on balloon flight

The biography by Mott Greene (now cited as a source) claims (page 95) that the record-setting balloon flight of 1904 was part of the Gordon Bennett International Balloon Competition. This contradicts the article on that competition, and also the statement in the present article that the flight was only motivated by meteorology and instrumentation. Sylvain Ribault (talk) 18:01, 3 May 2022 (UTC)

Discrepancy on burial

Again in the biography by Mott Greene (page 595), there is the statement that Else Wegener asked that her husband be buried in the mountains in Greenland, rather than left in the ice. Sylvain Ribault (talk) 18:47, 3 May 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 24 January 2023

Hello. I am AngelAlicorn and I learnt at my school that Alfred Wegener was left in the ice and snow and he STILL is! I just wanted people to know that. AngelAlicorn (talk) 22:27, 24 January 2023 (UTC)

This is covered in the Death section of the article. Unclear what changes you are asking for. Please make your request in the form of change X to Y. RudolfRed (talk) 22:41, 24 January 2023 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 21 April 2023

At Alfred Wegener#Early life and education, Wegener studied Physics, meteorology and Astronomy in Berlin, Heidelberg and Innsbruck. should be Wegener studied physics, meteorology and astronomy in Berlin, Heidelberg and Innsbruck. Boy has this article been semi'd for a long time! 199.208.172.35 (talk) 19:53, 21 April 2023 (UTC)

 Done Tollens (talk) 21:52, 21 April 2023 (UTC)