Talk:Trevor (duck)

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by AirshipJungleman29 talk 20:45, 30 November 2024 (UTC)

(

• Comment or view
• Article history

)

• ... that in 2018, "the world's loneliest duck" arrived on the remote Pacific island country of Niue, hundreds of kilometers from fresh water and any other duck?

• Source: "Still, living hundreds of miles away from any other duck wasn’t exactly ideal for Trevor" The New York Times, "Trevor is 'the world's loneliest duck'" ABC News, and "Niue has no surface streams because of the porous and fissured nature of its limestone surface. Even after prolonged heavy rainfall, the ground is dry within a few minutes." Wheeler & Aharon (2004)

• ALT0a: ... that "the world's loneliest duck" arrived on the remote Pacific island country of Niue in 2018? From Launchballer below
• ALT0b: ... that in 2018, "the world's loneliest duck" arrived on the remote island country of Niue, hundreds of kilometers from any other duck? Striking claim about fresh water, per TompaDompa's review as well as "Pacific" for conciseness
• ALT1: ... that Trevor the mallard was named after Trevor Mallard? Source: "The duck — which appeared earlier this year — is widely known as 'Trevor', after New Zealand's speaker of the House of Representatives, Trevor Mallard." ABC News
• ALT2: ... that political scientists use the naming of a lost duck as an example of diplomatic relations? Source: "Outside of diasporic ties, [pacific island countries] and communities also strategically establish close relationships with elites in partner states using cultural and traditional practices. ... In a less obligatory manner, Niue named their only duck Trevor, after then- New Zealand Speaker of the House of Representatives Trevor Mallard" Futaisi et al (2024), pp. 12–13
• Reviewed:

Moved to mainspace by Dan Leonard (talk) and Upjav (talk). Number of QPQs required: 0. Nominator has fewer than 5 past nominations.

Dan Leonard (talk • contribs) 02:34, 16 November 2024 (UTC).

• What about something that plays on the naming, like that "a mallard named Trevor was named for Trevor Mallard?" There might be a more fun / deliberately ambiguous way to word this, but I can't think of it. Upjav (talk) 19:01, 16 November 2024 (UTC)

Per WP:DYKTRIM, I suggest ALT0a: ... that "the world's loneliest duck" arrived on the remote Pacific island country of Niue in 2018?--Launchballer 16:29, 17 November 2024 (UTC)

• I will review this. TompaDompa (talk) 02:57, 17 November 2024 (UTC)

General: Article is new enough and long enough
New enough: Long enough:

Policy compliance:

• Adequate sourcing: - See below.
• Neutral:
• Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing:

Hook eligibility:

• Cited: - ALT1 meets the sourcing requirements. The other proposed hooks do not.
• Interesting:

QPQ: None required.

Overall: Article moved to mainspace on 16 November, and (barely) meets the length requirement. There are no obvious neutrality issues. Earwig reveals no copyvio, and I didn't spot any instances of unacceptable WP:Close paraphrasing. All of the proposed hooks are interesting; I have no strong preference between them. ALT0 and ALT0a need proper sourcing for "the world's loneliest duck" in the article (see below). ALT0 additionally needs "hundreds of kilometers from fresh water and any other duck" to be properly sourced in the article per WP:DYKHFC. ALT1 is adequately sourced. ALT2 is not mentioned in the article at all. This is the nominator's fifth DYK nomination (after Template:Did you know nominations/Seed oil misinformation, Template:Did you know nominations/Conspiracy theories about the 2024 Atlantic hurricane season, Template:Did you know nominations/Sheetz–Wawa rivalry, and Template:Did you know nominations/Charles de Gaulle's trip to South America), so they are QPQ exempt; it would have been the co-nominator's sixth (after Template:Did you know nominations/Tamakautoga, Template:Did you know nominations/Texas Reliability Entity, Template:Did you know nominations/Hunuki Hunukitama, Template:Did you know nominations/Narita Viliamu Tahega, and Template:Did you know nominations/18th Niue Assembly). Some comments on the content:

• Trevor began receiving media attention when The New Zealand Herald journalist Claire Trevett encountered the duck on a visit to Niue in September 2018 and reported on his appearance – this cites Trevett's own article, i.e. the WP:PRIMARYSOURCE. That's not ideal—how can we now that this was when the media attention began? Furthermore, while the article is from 5 September 2018, Trevett only specifies that the visit to Niue was "recently" which could be late August rather than September.
• as the distances from Australia and New Zealand are too great for the duck to have flown under his own effort – the cited source only says this about New Zealand, not Australia.
• Hundreds of miles from any known duck habitat and without a mate, he was known as "the world's loneliest duck" – the cited source does not state the distance to the nearest duck habitat (it only says "there are no ducks on Niue") and does not support the designation as "the world's loneliest duck" as headlines are not considered reliable sources per WP:HEADLINES.
• Trevor lived in a roadside puddle as a local celebrity, which was refilled by the Niue Fire Service and locals when it began to dry out. – the cited source only mentions the fire service refilling the puddle (locals are mentioned feeding the duck, but not refilling the puddle).
• whyevolutionistrue.com appears to be a blog. What makes it a WP:Reliable source for the information it is used to support here?
• speaker of the New Zealand Parliament – not a DYK requirement, but it would make more sense to link Speaker of the New Zealand House of Representatives.
• Niue received condolences from around the world, including from his namesake politician and media outlets including [...] – I don't think it's quite accurate to say that the media outlets gave their condolences. I would just say that they reported on the death.

Ping nominator Dan Leonard and co-nominator Upjav. TompaDompa (talk) 23:03, 17 November 2024 (UTC)

@TompaDompa: I have addressed most of your comments. Please see the article's history for the specific edits. However, I have not made any changes in regards to your first and fifth points.

• In regards to citing Trevett (2018), the first citation is simply for reader convenience, while the substantive part of the sentence (that Trevett's article led to virality) is cited to Victor (2019), which states "Eventually, his celebrity expanded beyond the island. When Claire Trevett, a senior writer at The New Zealand Herald, asked for directions while visiting Niue, someone told her to “turn right after the duck,” she wrote for the newspaper in September. After that, Trevor’s story rapidly spread to other international publications."
• While whyevolutionistrue.com is a blog, it is one run by a subject matter expert (ecologist Jerry Coyne) and is the best source available for the claim. Although suboptimal, it is not necessarily a violation of the sourcing policy.
• The article now more exactly says "hundreds of miles from any other duck" which may affect whether ALT0 meets WP:DYKHFC. Please consider re-reviewing if you feel it's necessary.
• Text supporting ALT2 was removed from the article after DYK submission. I think it was the weakest hook of the three, but if you think it is interesting feel free to restore it to the article so ALT2 meets WP:DYKHFC.

Thank you for the detailed review. Dan Leonard (talk • contribs) 23:22, 21 November 2024 (UTC)

Alright, let's see:

• I still don't think we can say that Trevett's visit to Niue was in September 2018. It was "recently" as of 5 September 2018. There are a few different ways of resolving this. One option is saying that it was "about half a year" after Trevor's arrival in January 2018, though that's a bit clunky.
• I suppose Coyne should be acceptable per WP:EXPERTSPS, then.
• If the source and article say hundreds of miles, it is perfectly fine for the hook to say hundreds of kilometers—100 miles is more than 100 km, after all. However, the distance to the nearest fresh water in ALT0 also needs to be in the article and properly sourced. ALT0a meets the sourcing requirements now, however.
• The article now says that mallards have been introduced to New Zealand, but I don't find this in the cited source?
• The article is now very close to being below the required minimum of 1,500 characters. This does not require any particular action, but should be kept in mind if you edit it further and make it shorter.

Ping nominator Dan Leonard and co-nominator Upjav. TompaDompa (talk) 17:57, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

@TompaDompa:

• Trevett date: rewrote sentence to "Trevett encountered the duck on a visit to Niue and reported on his appearance in an article published in September 2018", still a bit clunky but more precise?
• Miles/kilometers dispute: since this is an article that should follow MOS:TIES to NZ English for ENGVAR, I've changed the article to also use "kilometers" – The New York Times, as an American newspaper, used miles but I think kilometers is better here.
• Mallard introduction: added a source to Dyer & Williams (2010).
• ALT2: restored passage about diplomatic relations to allow ALT2 to meet WP:DYKHFC.

Pinging Upjav as original article creator for final thoughts. Dan Leonard (talk • contribs) 21:03, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Sorry, Dan Leonard - I've been jammed up IRL. This looks good - please don't let me hold you up. I appreciate you running this all to ground. Upjav (talk) 19:14, 27 November 2024 (UTC)

ALT0a, ALT0b, and ALT1 are ready. I don't think describing Trevor as a "lost" duck in ALT2 is entirely accurate, but substituting "errant" (or just omitting "lost" altogether) would be okay. TompaDompa (talk) 16:35, 23 November 2024 (UTC)