Draft talk:Miguel and the Living Dead

Draft: Miguel and the Living Dead

Hi,

I removed discogs as biographical sources. I removed source You Tube. In some places in the text, Discogs was used only as a source of records and bands in which the musicians played and play, and as a source of labels. The article in Polish Wikipedia has been available since 2007 https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miguel_and_the_Living_Dead MKutera74 (talk) 21:42, 17 December 2023 (UTC)

This is not a young band, because it was founded in 2001. He is quite recognizable in the areas of independent music with the aesthetics of gothic rock, post punk, death rock and psychobilly. There is no distortion of reality or facts about the band. This is objective information. In this matter, if there are any doubts, I advise you to consult your knowledge and competences with a good expert in the above-mentioned musical aesthetics. He will only confirm that this is not an amateur band, but one that already has a successful musical career. Please find out which bands MATLD played together at concerts and festivals, e.g. New Model Army, Sex Gang Children, The Damned, Clan Of Xymox, The Last Days Of Jesus, Combichrist, Deine Lakaien, Phantom Limbs, Lacrimosa, Nitzer Ebb, Samael, Theatre Of Tragedy, VNV Nation, The Legendary Pink Dots, Suicide Commando, Diary of Dreams, Front Line Assembly, She Past Away, XIII. Století, Lacuna Coil, Blutengel, Me And That Man, Section 25, Corpus Delicti. These are well-known bands in this music and music-related area. The concerts are supported by reliable sources in the article.

According to Wikipedia's rules, the team meets the requirements for publication.

1. Was the subject of many music articles (Polish and foreign) in professional magazines: Zillo, Orkus, Teraz Rock, Machina, Noise Magazine. This is confirmed by the sources in the article.

2. Is a niche band, so it certainly wasn't played on big music charts, but it was played on Polish Radio "Trójka" (for example, songs: Night of Terror and Bonehead) and Radiostacja. His songs are listed on last.fm (if that matters)

3. Has not yet been certified gold, but many bands on the wiki do not have such a status

4. Some concert reports are described on the Internet and in paper journals: Zillo, Orkus, Machina, Teraz Rock, Noise Magazine (mentioned above). The German-language Orkus is one of the most important and best music magazines of this aesthetic in the world.

5. Released two full-length albums, on two independent labels with several years of experience. The first German-Austrian, the second Polish. Several good bands released on Strobelight records: All Gone Dead, Frank the Baptist, Pink Turns Blue, The Last Days Of Jesus, Sleeping Children. The Noise Annoys label mainly releases albums by Polish bands, very popular on the Polish market, but also foreign ones (mainly punk rock aesthetics): TZN Xenna, One Milion Bulgarians, Apteka, Deuter, Variété, U.K. Subs. After several years on the music market, Strobelight Records ceased operations for unknown reasons. Noise Annoys has evolved into a record label and concert organizer [1][1]. Bands whose albums are released by Bat-Cave Productions are also presented: Dezerter, 1984, Wieże Fabryk, One Milion Bulgarians, Totem (see Polish wikipedia), Rozz Williams, Screaming Dead.

6. It is a band consisting of two ambitious, talented musicians who played in other famous bands: Pete - Devilish Presley, Klaus - TZN Xenna, One Million Bulgarians (see Polish wikipedia).

7. He is one of the important representatives of this aesthetic in Europe after 2000, and when it comes to Poland, there is no band apart from MATLD that would play post punk, goth rock, horror punk, deathrock, psychobilly at the same time (they write about it in Zillo, Orkus, Machina, Noise Magazine). Yes, there are several famous bands, but they play classic goth rock combined with gothic metal or dark wave, among others: Closterkeller, Deathcamp Project etc (see polish wikipedia).

8. Was nominated for an award at the Polish concert in Jarocin in 2006, but only won an honorable mention due to the fact that the lyrics were only in English (there is a source confirming this).

9. In total as above. It was certainly appreciated at the largest festival in Europe, Castle Party in Bolków. He played there twice. It's strange that there is no article about this festival on the English-language Wikipedia!

10. This team was not in the media. Only brief mentions of festivals on regional television and concerts in various countries. This will be difficult to verify.

11. It was thanks to Noise Annoys in Poland, the band was played on Polish radio "Trójka", "Radiostacja" and was the subject of music articles in Teraz Rock and Noise Magazine. Thanks to Strobelight Records, he gained attention mainly in German popular music magazines (Zillo and Orkus).

12. Miguel and the Living Dead only appeared on a few Polish radio programs Trójka and Radiostacja. He didn't appear on TV programs, apart from short interviews covering music festivals (in Polish and English).

I'm also adding information from discogs, because it is a very reliable source, especially when it comes to the line-up, connections, albums, etc. Please see Carcass, discogs is also quoted there. Many concert materials are available on You Tube, but I decided not to quote them.

I have practically all photocopies of paper music articles (Zillo, Orkus, Noise Magazine, Teraz Rock). I can send.

Please approach the article substantively in these musical areas, objectively and seriously. Please also appreciate my contribution. MKutera74 (talk) 17:05, 5 June 2024 (UTC)

@MKutera74 You appear to have applied every single criterion at WP:NBAND to the draft subject, which is unnecessary; the vast majority of bands with Wikipedia articles only meet the first criterion (has sources discussing them). Meeting multiple criterions is not the common standard.

Please wait for another reviewer to approve or decline the draft, since I don't do re-reviews on demand. I see you have worked on the draft since I declined it, which is promising. Mach61 12:09, 7 June 2024 (UTC)

(copied from my talk page) AngusW🐶🐶F (bark • sniff) 16:36, 14 December 2023 (UTC)

I removed discogs as biographical sources. In some places in the text, Discogs was used only as a source of records and bands in which the musicians played and play, and as a source of labels. The article in Polish Wikipedia has been available since 2007 https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miguel_and_the_Living_Dead MKutera74 (talk) 21:42, 17 December 2023 (UTC)

Hi Angus,

the previous version may have been poor, but it was not a promotional item for the band. This is not a young band, because it was founded in 2001. He is quite recognizable in the areas of independent music with the aesthetics of gothic rock, post punk, death rock and psychobilly. There is no distortion of reality or facts about the band. This is objective information. In this matter, if there are any doubts, I advise you to consult your knowledge and competences with a good expert in the above-mentioned musical aesthetics. He will only confirm that this is not an amateur band, but one that already has a successful musical career. Please find out which bands MATLD played together at concerts and festivals, e.g. New Model Army, Sex Gang Children, The Damned, Clan Of Xymox, The Last Days Of Jesus, Combichrist, Deine Lakaien, Phantom Limbs, Lacrimosa, Nitzer Ebb, Samael, Theatre Of Tragedy, VNV Nation, The Legendary Pink Dots, Suicide Commando, Diary of Dreams, Front Line Assembly, She Past Away, XIII. Století, Lacuna Coil, Blutengel, Me And That Man. These are well-known bands in this music and music-related area. The concerts are supported by reliable sources in the article.

According to Wikipedia's rules, the team meets the requirements for publication.

1. was the subject of many music articles (Polish and foreign) in professional magazines: Zillo, Orkus, Teraz Rock, Machina, Noise Magazine. This is confirmed by the sources in the article.

2. is a niche band, so it certainly wasn't played on big music charts, but it was played on Polish Radio "Trójka" (for example, songs: Night of Terror and Bonehead) and Radiostacja. His songs are listed on last.fm (if that matters)

3. has not yet been certified gold, but many bands on the wiki do not have such a status

4. some concert reports are described on the Internet and in paper journals: Zillo, Orkus, Machina, Teraz Rock, Noise Magazine (mentioned above). The German-language Orkus is one of the most important and best music magazines of this aesthetic in the world.

5. released two full-length albums, on two independent labels with several years of experience. The first German-Austrian, the second Polish. Several good bands released on Strobelight records: All Gone Dead, Frank the Baptist, Pink Turns Blue, The Last Days Of Jesus, Sleeping Children. The Noise Annoys label mainly releases albums by Polish bands, very popular on the Polish market, but also foreign ones (mainly punk rock aesthetics): TZN Xenna, One Milion Bulgarians, Apteka, Deuter, Variété, U.K. Subs. After several years on the music market, Strobelight Records ceased operations for unknown reasons. Noise Annoys has evolved into a record label and concert organizer [1]. Bands whose albums are released by Bat-Cave Productions are also presented: Dezerter, 1984, Wieże Fabryk, One Milion Bulgarians, Totem (see Polish wikipedia), Rozz Williams, Screaming Dead.

6. It is a band consisting of two ambitious, talented musicians who played in other famous bands: Pete - Devilish Presley, Klaus - TZN Xenna, One Million Bulgarians (see Polish wikipedia).

7. He is one of the important representatives of this aesthetic in Europe after 2000, and when it comes to Poland, there is no band apart from MATLD that would play post punk, goth rock, horror punk, deathrock, psychobilly at the same time (they write about it in Zillo, Orkus, Machina, Noise Magazine). Yes, there are several famous bands, but they play classic goth rock combined with gothic metal or dark wave, among others: Closterkeller, Deathcamp Project etc (see polish wikipedia).

8. was nominated for an award at the Polish concert in Jarocin in 2006, but only won an honorable mention due to the fact that the lyrics were only in English (there is a source confirming this).

9. in total as above. It was certainly appreciated at the largest festival in Europe, Castle Party in Bolków. He played there twice. It's strange that there is no article about this festival on the English-language Wikipedia!

10. this team was not in the media. Only brief mentions of festivals on regional television and concerts in various countries. This will be difficult to verify.

11. it was thanks to Noise Annoys in Poland, the band was played on Polish radio "Trójka", "Radiostacja" and was the subject of music articles in Teraz Rock and Noise Magazine. Thanks to Strobelight Records, he gained attention mainly in German popular music magazines (Zillo and Orkus).

12. Miguel and the Living Dead only appeared on a few Polish radio programs Trójka and Radiostacja. He didn't appear on TV programs, apart from short interviews covering music festivals (in Polish and English).

I'm also adding information from discogs, because it is a very reliable source, especially when it comes to the line-up, connections, albums, etc. Please see Carcass, discogs is also quoted there. Many concert materials are available on You Tube, but I decided not to quote them.

Please approach the article substantively in these musical areas, objectively and seriously. Please also appreciate my contribution. MKutera74 (talk) 01:34, 13 December 2023 (UTC)

I removed discogs as biographical sources. In some places in the text, Discogs was used only as a source of records and bands in which the musicians played and play, and as a source of labels MKutera74 (talk) 19:39, 17 December 2023 (UTC)

1. The article was written by me much earlier in the English version (in 2023), based on the Polish version updated by me, than this page (which was created only in June 2024). I know the page https://www.matld.org/main.html, but I did not quote it, because it is prepared for the release of the new album. The band asked me not to post it on Wikipedia for now. Materials about MATLD are verified and 100% certain. I have full rights to the photos, I sent permissions to the Polish version of Wikipedia. The official website of the band will be cited only after the official release of the next album this year. It is still under development. Currently, talks are underway with the record companies, the material is already recorded and ready for release. Please post the article, because this is a strange action, to say the least. I own the copyright to this text 100%. I transfer copyright to Wikimedia Commons.

2. I have absolutely no financial or legal benefits from this. I only have the copyright, because I created and wrote this article myself, providing the sources. I am aware that I am transferring the copyright to Wikimedia Commons. Since about 2005/2006 I have been editing Miguel and the Living Dead for free on the Polish wiki. I have been interested in the music of this aesthetic for about 30 years (I have a lot of books, CDs, vinyls, cassettes, all original editions from all over the world). Finally I updated it and decided that it is worth making an English version for MATLD. I have been following the band for years and going to their concerts. I know their biographies very well. I know the musicians (by the way, I know many Polish bands, including some musicians personally, but I decided that there should be an English version for MATLD, because the line-up has become international and the band has played and continues to play with international bands not only in Poland). I sent them the translation and they asked if they could put it on the new page, so I said ok. How could I know that this would be a conflict. I am not their manager. Their page was created by someone else, I don't know this person at all. I just found out by accident that MATLD is being revived and decided to write an article. I regret all this hard work since October 2023 and unfortunately I didn't write this draft in the rough draft.

3. Draft has been restored.

4. More about this: https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/User_talk:MKutera74#c-Bobby_Cohn-20240824013400-August_2024

https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/User_talk:Bobby_Cohn

5. Pickersgill-Cunliffe wrote ... "can confirm that the Wikipedia draft was written prior to the creation of the website. As such the band website is mirroring the text and it is not a copyright infringement. That said, you note that "I own the copyright to this text 100%". Are you aware that by publishing this work to Wikipedia you are releasing it under license as BC explains above? There will be no copyright. You also need to explain in far more detail what you mean by sentences such as "The band asked me not to post it on Wikipedia for now." I see on your talk page that you claim "no financial or legal benefits" but you clearly have a close involvement with the band. I have undeleted Draft:Miguel and the Living Dead based on the mistaken G12. Please add a section to the talk page of the draft explaining your involvement and the creation of the website, so that future reviewers understand."

I hope that the article will be accepted and posted on the English Wikipedia. MKutera74 (talk) 11:27, 24 August 2024 (UTC)