Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2006 October 4

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Faked X and Y Chromosomes

Has anyone heard of the Genetic Update Conference? Well anyways, the lecturer showed us pictures of X and Y chromosomes that had been edited with genes like "Selective Hearing Loss (HUH)" for the Y and several shopping genes for the X. I Googled this already to no avail. Anyone seen these out there at all? Deltacom1515 00:02, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Humorous karyotypes like that have been shown at various genetics lectures for at least 40 years. There are lots of funny medical slides that have never been published for a variety of reasons. alteripse 01:37, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

More seriously, a doctor friend said he sometimes told parents of children of ambiguous anatomical gender that their baby girl was missing one leg of one of her two X chromosomes, while drawing out a Y to demonstrate how the X was missing a leg.Edison 07:27, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

We will keep such children away from him. That approach was questionable twenty years ago and is really asking for trouble today. alteripse 00:13, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Grand Mufti

Why haveth not the US a Grand Mufti?

According to the very first line of the article you linked to - "The title of Grand Mufti ( Arabic: مفتي عام‎) refers to the highest official of religious law in a Sunni Muslim country". The only way you could be asking this question in good faith is if you think the US is a Sunni Muslim country... --Mnemeson 01:18, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

But I think it's a fair question. The United States is as much a Sunni Muslim country as Australia, which has a grand mufti, as does France. In general, the grand mufti is named or recognized by the government of the country where he presides. Because of the constitutional mandate of separation of church and state, the United States government would never officially sanction such a religious office. Australia apparently has an unofficial grand mufti. The United States does not, probably at least partly because the Muslim population of the United States is diverse and not centrally organized. There are several U.S. Muslim organizations, each of which might not recognize a figure coming from one of the other organizations as the legitimate grand mufti. Marco polo 01:27, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

When I edit at 2am, remind me to read past the first line in articles... I apologise for the disbelief in my remark. Although I do feel a better opening line might be "the highest official of Sunni Muslim religious law in their particular country", as the way it currently reads implies that only SM countries have one. I'll.. stop digging this hole now. --Mnemeson 01:42, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

There is one. He shares an apartment in Georgetown with his partner, the Head Rabbi.

grudge

what is this grudge all the papers speak of with respect to the Amish-girl killer?

read our article: 2006 Amish school shooting. Rmhermen 01:42, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

there is nothing about a grudge in there. Please give relevant answers. Thanks.

You have not supplied enough deatils to your question, so it is kabuki [sic]. Iolakana•T 16:58, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Rome Total War

Does anyone know how to extract video from Rome: Total War? I need to use it for a history project, and looked everywhere. Thanks! -- Sturgeonman 01:18, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

If you can't find a way, there's always HyperCam or Camtasia. -Elmer Clark 01:49, 4 October 2006 (UTC) edit: well, ok, no articles, but you can Google them.

It's not exactly what you want, but [Fraps http://www.fraps.com/] might help. In Medieval:Total War, the intro movies are simply .mpg files, but I presume you want the battle replays which I can't immediately locate. --Mnemeson 01:51, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

The video files are saved as .rpy format (if you can't find the folder, just search your system for all .rpy files). Once you have those, this forum should help you out (sends you to instructions here). Good luck with the project :) --Mnemeson 01:58, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

The female House Representative (?) who made statements against women's right to vote

I recall reading about a woman who was in the House (pretty sure it wasn't the Senate) who made some statements saying that women didn't need the right to vote or something. She also once said that if her husband asked her to leave her position in Congress that she would do so. This was within the last ten years.

I'm really paraphrasing here and may have gotten the details wrong. Anyway - what's her name? Is there a Wikipedia entry about her? I couldn't find it due to the necessary vagueness of my search terms.

Thank you.

It was a State Senator from Kansas, Kay O’Connor. She doesn't have a Wikipedia article, but see here: [1]. Ziggurat 09:12, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

payment on non traditional services

please narrate the circumstances under which insurance companies in US pays to the doctors for non traditional services like telephone calls, emails, missed appointments etc or the doctor can charge directly to the patient for these services?

Information on media and superstitions

How does the Media help in reinforcing Superstitions? --Minni--

They portray an extremely biased view of the news, by only showing the exciting parts. For example, they only show lottery winners, not the millions of losers. Thus, people watching TV would get the impression that everyone who ever plays the lottery eventually wins millions, since that's all they ever see. There are many other examples. StuRat 18:28, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

I think you misunderstand what news is. News is not an assembly of all possible facts and events that occur on a given day - not even Wikipedia does that. Just showing the lottery winners does not constitute bias against the losers, rather it's what people are much more likely to be interested in. If the media showed all the millions of losing lottery ticket buyers, nobody would buy such a paper or watch such a TV program. Except you, that is. Maybe you need to get out more, Stu.  :--) JackofOz 21:06, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

I stated myself that they only list the interesting stories. The fact remains, however, that this presents a highly biased view of the world where everyone who plays the lottery wins. StuRat 23:58, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

I don't regard this as bias. The fact that the only entries that get reported are the winning ones does not equate to "everyone who plays the lottery wins". The hype from the lottery operators is all about "Buy a ticket - you could win millions", but that is a far cry from suggesting all you have to do is hang in there and your turn will eventually come. Most addicted gamblers do believe it's only a matter of time, which makes it so hard for them to break the cycle. To return to the question, does the media reinforce the almost vain hopes that punters have? The only way to be absolutely certain of that not happening is to ban all media advertising of lotteries and all media reporting of results. What happens when someone wins a record-breaking amount but the media can't report it? They'd be accused of not doing their job of telling people interesting stories about what's going on in the world. Far better to allow advertising of lotteries and reporting of results, as long as it's done responsibly, without punters being misled as to their chances. JackofOz 08:48, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

That's the way people's minds work, unfortunately (at least those who pay the stupidity tax). If they've heard of 1000 people buying a lottery ticket, and heard of 500 winners, they conclude that 50% of the people who buy lottery tickets win. StuRat 01:11, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

There are also many stories about ghosts and aliens on TV, almost all of which support their existence, because it's more interesting. StuRat 18:28, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Hey Stu, let's start up our own news channel that reports sightings of no UFOs, losing bingo numbers, and people not getting killed on their way to work. It will be the biggest TV revolution since those high-definition broadcasts of WWI footage!  freshofftheufoΓΛĿЌ  12:33, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

At the least, they could add a disclaimer to the end of each story "Meanwhile, 10 million other people who played the lottery lost". Also, I believe there is a news org that only reports good news, to counter all the bad news you get in traditional news. StuRat 23:53, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Actually, I would totally support that. And I've heard of that "good news" thing too, maybe a web cast?  freshofftheufoΓΛĿЌ  17:03, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Sorry chaps, Good news is no news!--Light current 01:17, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

According to Good news, Good News is a newspaper in Scandinavia with only happy news. I hope it does better than the US paper I read about some years ago. It too only reported happy news, but it didn't sell due to lack of interest, and went out of business. The paper did not report its own forthcoming demise because that would not have satisifed the criterion of good news. JackofOz 01:56, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

Before there were 'moist towelettes' -

- was there ever any such thing as a 'towelette'? Are all 'towelettes' therefore by definition moist? If so, shouldn't we be calling them just 'towelettes'?

Further, to Australian Wikipedians of a certain age - before there were 'Iced Vovos', was there ever any such thing as a 'Vovo'? Are all Vovos by definition iced? If so, shouldn't we have been calling them just 'Vovos'?

Adambrowne666 11:56, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

To my knowledge, there were never any Vovos before Iced Vovos. Your crusade against tautology is commendable, however proprietary names use a great deal of creative licence and the usual rules don't apply. The market place determines what sells and what doesn't, and that's the only rule that really matters. Iced Vovos has a certain rhythm to it, whereas Vovos is bit brusque. Asking for "a packet of Vovos" sounds too much like "a packet of Ovos", and nobody knows what Ovos are, because they don't exist. Iced Vovos are delicious, but if they had been called "Flattened Energy Cakes", or even just "Vovos", I doubt they would have become the iconic culinary classics they are today. JackofOz 12:33, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

What are they? Volvos? And, by the way, there are "dry towelettes" I don't kjnow if that is a kind of backformation though. Rmhermen 16:14, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Are Iced Vovos as tasty as MoonPie?Edison 17:20, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, that's matter of individual taste. They're not really comparable items. Iced Vovos are biscuits with pink icing and coconut, but no icecream. JackofOz 20:39, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Only graham cracker, marshmellow, chocolate, and lots of sugar in a Moon Pie. Maybe you were thinking of Eskimo Pie. Wiki needs an article on Iced Vovos as well.Edison 14:13, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

I was indeed thinking of an Eskimo Pie (or is that Inuit Pie these days?). JackofOz 22:06, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

I reckon the marketing team who came up with the neologism 'towelette' was brilliant - what are the alternatives? 'Damp napkin'? 'Humid serviette'? - nothing else conveys the idea of cleanliness and ultimate dryness, despite the initial moistness of the towelette experience.

And, yeah, 'dry towelette' is a kind of backformation I would say - if there is such a thing as a towelette, then in one case or the other, it need not be stated that it is moist or dry respectively. If that makes sense. Adambrowne666 08:19, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Minnesota No Waste Law: I the Consumer, being asked to remove the siding on a new construction home after it is 8 months old amd Inspector states he does not "recall that day", that he saw the siding that was going to be mounted on our home!!!

We live in Lindstrom, Minnesota, Franconia Township, Chisago County. We had a new construction home built and completed in October, 2005. During the construction, the inspector from Chisago County came out to do an inspection on the home. People present were myself, and the workers; husband was not there. Inspector came, he asked me what the additional support on the framing was for; I said, the siding; inspector asked; what kind of siding is it? I answered, come, I will show you, it's right here; he came and glanced at it, and said, well goodbye, have a nice day. Now he is stating he does not recall that day. The siding is Corrugated Steel Siding. After the home was 8 months old, a man from the Zoning Committee came to our home with a lady, co-worker; my husband and I were working on our five acres; landscaping. His name is Jim. Jim came up to me; introduced himself as Jim from the Zoning Department at Chisago County. Next statement from his, was; You people have to remove that siding; it does not fall correctly under our ordinances. My husband came from around the garage and asked what they wanted; Jim, again, stated you must take your siding off this house, it is not in compliance to our ordinances. My husband asked what ordinance is that; Jim stated, all siding has to be horizontal and wood looking. My husband stated; why didn't the inspector that has been the inspector for over 20 years for the County; why did he not tell us the day he came out and saw the extra support and siding? Jim, the inspector said, we can't answer for him. My husband said, well if he has been inspector for over 20 years and has inspected two other of my homes on the next ten acres over, you would think he would know the oridinances by now? My husband asked; I would like to meet with the Zoning Committee? Jim said; we are it, you are talking to the Zoning Committee; If you feel you have to have a meeting with us, it will cost you $285.00. My husband filed for a meeting; committee did not look at any of any data or photos of others homes; they handed him a piece of paper that said, "Denied", already typed on it; the paper was prepared before the meeting. The Zoning Committee said; you can appeal that if you wish; we are not sure what the fee is. We have contacted our County Commissioner; an attorney; and etc. There are other homes of same siding all throughout other counties that we are only 1 to 5 miles from the County Line. Not is the siding extremely efficient; environmentally friendly; recyclable; they now have a small sample scale with the same siding on in our Science Museum in St. Paul, Minnesota. We were told by someone that has worked at the County for several years that many consumers pay several hundreds of dollars to meet with this Zoning Committee several times a year to have an ordinance looked at; changed; or whatever; and she stated the County has not changed a thing for years and they don't intend on it; whether it be for siding or whatever.

I found out 2 weeks ago; a man in Washington County, which is 1 miles from us at the line; of course Washington County is extremely large. This man lives in a development; back in 1995 he laid grass seed down; his grass seed of course turned into a beautiful lawn; weeks later the Ordinance Developer came to him, and said the ordinance of the that development says you must lay sod down, not seed. They instructed him to till it all up and lay sod. He contacted his attorney; his attorney found a law for the State of Minnesota; State Wide; that does not permit any County to force a consumer to removed something from their property if it shall be a "Waste". Like I said, the County came here when the home was 8 months old; their inspector already approved it; he doesn't recollect that day; the County will not give us our "Certificate of Occupancy"; they say we are living here illegally. I wished I could send you photos of our home and landscaping. We have a driveway that is 400 feet long and the home is tucked in so far in the pines; we have stopped passerbys and asked them what kind of siding do they think we have; all of them think it is Stucco. This particular Corrugated Siding has been proven not to warp; fade; and be 65 percent more efficient that any other siding you could placed on your home; and why is it that Chisago County would not allow this "Horizontal" siding when every other County around them allow it; and furthermore; these other Counties are very strict regarding their oridances; but they feel it is beneficial to the homeowner; the appearances are very clean lined; it is structural safe. When we had our 95 degree weather for the summer of 2006; it stayed so cool in our home that we hardly used the Air Conditioner; infact; this is our third home built in this County; and this home is to be our retirement home; wheelchair access; my husband and I are both retired for 8 years now; we live on my husband's Social Security; I have several health issues; and the County is asking us to remove our siding and take out a loan and replace it. Now I ask you; where do we get the help we need? We are desperate in need of help; we would very much like to get our Certificate of Occupancy. I forgot to mention; we had to meet with our Township first; may I mention; it cost us nothing to meet with them; our township for the life of them could not figure out why the County was doing this to us because the home has a very clean and nice looking appearance; and especially the fact that the siding will be on for 200 years. Our Township leader; John Green even went up to the County to talk to them; they resued to listen. Please help us. We two retired people who just want to live out the rest of our lives, what is left of it. We have had many, many months of sleepless nights; my doctor knows how this is affecting our health.

Thank you from the bottom and top of our Hearts!

Wikipedia cannot provide legal advice. You might wish to contact an attorney if you want to contest the decisions of the local zoning people in Chisago County. In the city of Chicago, there was once a tradition of giving small gifts to building inspectors. Their extreme gratitude for the small gift likely caused them to have such tears of joy that they could not see certain construction details. The $285 you paid for the Denial would likely have been enough to have that effect. Seriously, I have heard of homeowners and builders successfully challenging even very reasonable zoning laws, but just asking nicely usually won't cut it. If you can't afford a lawyer (and sometimes they will work on a contingency fee, where you split the proceeds with them, but more likely you would have to pay for their services) you might try newspapers, tv reporters, and your state representative, and your U.S. congressment. It might be awkward for the local officials to explain their theories of code enforcement. The manufacturer of the siding might be willing to help with documentation that the material meets all building codes for your area, since such codes usually are based on national model codes. Good luck!Edison 17:30, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

I know I feel for you, inspectors can be difficult. But, without giving legal advice (which you should get) I think that you have limited options. You can't win arguing with the local zoning. If you pull something out of your hat with a lawyer, they will be angry and get you in some other way. The only way that you can deal with this is to go to the city/county (whatever is local) and ask for a variance. Perhaps if you tell them that the inspector that was there before had not mentioned it to you, and that it is very expensive, they may give you a variance. They will not if you are combatitive, for sure.

The inspector who was out there ther first time is only responsible for what he was inspecting (the framing) and you will have a paper that he gave you, or one that was posted on site that he endorsed, that states what it was he inspected. Regardless of what he may have said, you can't hold him to anything else. Even if he had given you "advice" on the siding, it isn't codumented. The general contractor should have know the local zoning laws, and you could hold him responsible. If you are doing it yourself, and have no contractor, then you are responsible for knowing the zoning laws that apply. So, as much as I would like to be helpful, I think you are in a difficult place with few options. The only legal method is to prepare with a list of good reasons, perhaps invluding the no waste law you spoke about, as well as a politely worded statement about the previous inspector "accidentally" misleading you, and ask for a zoning variance for the life of the siding (15-30 years). If you are polite, and ask the right way, and no one in your community shows up to contest it, they are likely to try and satisfy your request. Atom 17:46, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

"codumented?" sounds fishy!Edison 03:51, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Another possible approach would be to sidestep the bureaucrats and contact your county commissioners, or whatever they call your elected representatives at the county level. (You could do this in combination with contacting your local newspaper. The best way might be, if the elected official is noncommital, to tell the elected official that you are thinking of contacting the local newspaper and that the local newspaper will no doubt want to know the elected official's position on the matter.) The elected official might be able to work out some kind of a deal with the bureaucrats, since he/she presumably has some say over whether they continue in their positions. Marco polo 18:33, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

emergency exit sign design

An emergency exit sign. This stick man is obviously running in blind panic...

Why, when we're told to "walk, not run" to the nearest emergency exit, do the signs (in the EU at least) feature a pictogram of someone running towards an exit?

thanks Spiggy

Hehe, good question. I have no answer, but I'd like to show you a funny version. —Bromskloss 15:00, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

The 'running man' seems to be required by EU regulations. I think it's a good question too. My guess is that emergency exit signs are supposed to guide the way out in case of a fire etc., they are not designed to guide our behavior. The behavioral aspect ("don't run", for instance) should have been taught at an earlier point, by your employer or safety inspector at work, by practising fire drills, by having instructions posted in your hotel room or stuck in your airline seat pocket and so forth. To be recognizable within a split second, a running man is probably more effective in conveying the sense of 'emergency exit' than a strolling man would be. I suppose it's also a matter of convention and we've gotten used to immediately understanding the message of the white man running in front of a green background.---Sluzzelin 16:33, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Does anyone have a link to an image? I'd like to know how it shows "running" as opposed to "walking" in a static design. Dismas|^(talk) 23:35, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

I've posted one, above. The angle of the trunk of the stick man suggests to me running. --Tagishsimon (talk)

It looks more natural in an urgent and dangerous situation, though... 惑乱 分からん 11:07, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

I see now and concur that it would denote running, thanks. Dismas|^(talk) 16:11, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Maybe its to denote the emergencey part, possibly not the best way of doing it, but a man walking towards a door would just suggest exit, as opposed to emergency exit. Philc _T^E_C^I 20:03, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

lol, I was in europe for 2 weeks before it dawned on me what those signs meant. I kept seeing them everywhere and could not figure it out. So obvious once it dawned on me though. Just so used to the EXIT signs in the U.S.

I also like the little fly sticker on the inside of urinals (I guess to encourage guys to aim.) Nowimnthing 23:44, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Most of the time I shoot at an angle into the side of the urinal so it doesnt splash back all over my pants --froth^{T C} 07:04, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

Fedor Baikov.

Im looking for more detailed information on Fedor Baikov the russian diplomat sent to china in 1654, but I cant seem to find any wikipedia articles, is there none or is it spelled differently? Joneleth 15:05, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

I could not find much information but here is a short biog http://books.google.com/books?vid=OCLC08877441&id=Ozbtt8E31ZcC&pg=PA3&lpg=PA3&dq=boicoot It appears his account is publish but not translated into English. MeltBanana#

ORID

My friend has hit a road block attempting to determine what ORID is. He knows that it is somehow related to essays (in his chicano studies class), and thinks that this may be an acronym for something, but what? Any help would be apreciated.

Objective Reflective Interpretive Decisional? See here. Ziggurat 00:03, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, thats it. Thanks for the help.

Airport runway staff's light wand thingies

Er... what are these things called? They look like big glowing popsicles, and guys on runways wave them. I've looked in airport and various runway lighting articles on Wikipedia, but I can't find any information on the portable lights that ground crews have. Searching with strings like "airport runway staff light" inevitably gives me results about runway lights, or airplane lights, etc. --MattShepherd 15:41, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

According to this page, they are "orange flashlight wands." --LarryMac 16:04, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Ah, here we go ... "marshalling wands." --LarryMac 16:14, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

What happens when they are pingpong bats? If it is any help the US navy seems to call the wavers "aircraft directors" MeltBanana 16:37, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Germany

Why are the colors of the German flag Black red and gold ?

See Flag of Germany. — Lomn 18:22, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

The development and changes in industry in the world today.

I want a lot of information on the following( about 2-3 pages on each):

1. The needs of modern industry - land, labour, capital, energy and space. 2. The distribution of agro-based and mineral based industrial regions in the different continents. 3. Case study of any three industrial areas one in each continent. 4. The number of workers in industrial and tertiary sectors in developed and developing countries and the reasons for the differences. 5. Rights of the workers and the condition of the workers in the mining and unorganized sector especially, women.

And that's exactly what the internet is for. Good luck. (Do your own homework) -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 18:16, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Mythology

Which disciplines is the study of mythology generally considered to be a part of? 64.198.112.210 18:40, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Theology? Joneleth 19:06, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Mythology can be studied from several disciplinary perspectives. Some disciplines that might be concerned with mythology are religion (the social science, aka "religious studies"), psychology, semiotics, classics (including such subfields as Egyptology), and anthropology. Marco polo 19:14, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

I would say literature, especially something like The Odyssey. StuRat 19:15, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

One's own faith in things unseen is Religion, and the study of it is Theology. The other person's similar belief and study of other gods is mythology. When Christianity became the established religion of the Roman Empire under Constantine, the priests of the Roman and Greek religions were systematically slaughtered and the worship banned. Go figure.Edison 14:18, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Cultural Anthropology. 66.146.62.39 19:41, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

See Classics. User:Zoe|(talk) 03:28, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Can cats be allergic to humans?

Can cats or another animal be allergic to humans? Is it really possible to be allergic to a person you don't like? Reywas92^Talk 21:01, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

I read about a woman once that was allergic to her boyfriend's sperm. It sounded very sad to me... =S 惑乱 分からん 11:05, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Well not exactly his sperm, but some women can be allergic to certain proteins in sperm. She can still get artificially inseminated without the sperm proteins though.Joneleth 12:52, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Doesnt that take all the fun out of it? 8-)--Light current 17:31, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Unless they like turkey basters.--Hunter85014 04:23, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Well only if you hate fucking with condom on, othervise theres not much of an issue. Joneleth 11:18, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Chocolate

Can chocolate cause constipation? Reywas92^Talk 21:01, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

No and Yes. CambridgeBayWeather (Talk) 22:05, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Internet loses!  freshofftheufoΓΛĿЌ  17:01, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Nasty MSN bug

Did anyone's computer get infected with the new MSN virus? One of your friends sends you a link and when you click that link, your computer becomes infected and the virus sends itself to everyone on your contact list. If so, can anyone tell me how to get rid of the virus on a Windows XP if system restore doesn't work? Jamesino 21:37, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

When isn't there a nasty MSN thing? ...especially when mixed with IE. I removed one a while ago, and it required an awful lot of reading and downloading. --Zeizmic 00:36, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Wouldn't this be better answered over at the Computing/IT desk? Clarityfiend 00:56, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

• Try symantec.com or macafee.com to find instructions on how to remove the virus. Side note: a bug and a virus are different things in computer terms. While bugs may have nasty results, they're generally a result of accidental bad programming instead of purposely malicious intent. - Mgm|^(talk) 10:24, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Template:Award2

Template:Award2 says something in Latin. What does it say? Thanks! Reywas92^Talk 22:00, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

See Lorem Ipsum. 惑乱 分からん 22:09, 4 October 2006 (UTC)