Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/In closing

WP:CRFD

August 1

Eli Kowaz

Eli Kowaz → Israel Policy Forum#Eli Kowaz (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]

Not mentioned in target. There was a lot (probably too much) content on him earlier, which was removed by User:IPFcomms with the rationale that he was no longer with the org. Unsure if content on him should be in the article, but if it isn't the redirect should be deleted. Rusalkii (talk) 23:26, 24 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. The AfD provided grist to doubt his notability even with the IPF; now that he's no longer there it makes no sense for the redirect to be to IPF. Longhornsg (talk) 23:46, 24 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment @CFA restored the section covering Eli Kowaz, with justification "Restoring section removed by promotional editor". If the section is kept (which I think it shouldn't be, see e.g. LinkedIn confirming he is no longer at the company), the redirect should be too. Rusalkii (talk) 19:43, 31 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, CycloneYoris ^talk! 21:29, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support for President Donald Trump by white Americans

Support for President Donald Trump by white Americans → Donald Trump 2016 presidential campaign#Supporter demographics (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]
White support for Donald Trump → Donald Trump 2016 presidential campaign#Supporter demographics (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]
White support of donald trump → Donald Trump 2016 presidential campaign#White nationalists and white supremacists (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]

Couple of concerns with these redirects' wordings:

It's odd that a redirect with this phrasing targets 1 of 4 presidential campaign pages related to Donald Trump running for president. How can there be any guarantee readers searching this phrase are looking for this target?
Specific to the current target, the first redirect contains the phrase "President Donald Trump"; Donald Trump was not a President until after the 2016 campaign.

Steel1943 (talk) 20:20, 24 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps Racial views of Donald Trump would be a better target? Nightscream (talk) 21:59, 24 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Not particularly. The redirects allude to groups of people who support for Donald Trump, not Donald Trump's views that could potentially be racist. Steel1943 (talk) 05:09, 25 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, CycloneYoris ^talk! 21:28, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support for Donald Trump

Support for Donald Trump → Trumpism (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]

The redirect does not seem to identify or describe the target. The target is more about ideologies, and not about those who support Donald Trump. There may be a plausible target out there, but I'm not sure. Steel1943 (talk) 20:16, 24 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The target is Trumpism, which is indeed a reasonable description. Nightscream (talk) 21:55, 24 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep The article is about Trump's ideology and those of his supporters. The lede makes it pretty clear that the two are inextriacbly linked, and there doesn't seem to be a better target. - Presidentman talk · contribs (Talkback) 15:51, 25 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Retarget to Opinion polling on the Donald Trump administration with a hatnote to Trumpism. Our article on Trumpism is not about supporting Donald Trump, but the ideology that spawned from him. Ca ^{talk to me!} 16:03, 25 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Keep or retarget?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, CycloneYoris ^talk! 21:28, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. I think Ca's suggestion is plausible but that the original target is better. -- asilvering (talk) 01:58, 6 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Brock Harrison

Brock Harrison → Brock (Pokémon) (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]

i do not want to elaborate on how many layers of obscure fanon this is, so i hope the explanation can begin and end at "that's fanmade" cogsan _{(nag me) (stalk me)} 16:13, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment there's apparently an old interview featuring Brock's VA where he mentions this information, but it seems pretty trivial regardless. Linking the archived link of the interview that I could find, but admittedly I'm not sure if this would sway anything either way. Has one ever considered Magneton? Pokelego999 (talk) 18:27, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

...huh. won't debate the canonicity of that (debatable as its canonicity is, see word of saint paul on tv tropes), but i will suggest not risking adding it to avoid enabling that side of the pokémon fandom fanfic fandom cogsan _{(nag me) (stalk me)} 01:15, 21 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete as very obscure synonym even if true --Lenticel ^(talk) 02:42, 28 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment I don't intend to vote on this, but it is plausable that the surname was given to the character in some international dubbings. At least I personally have a recollection of this being the case and thus the R being a plausable search term, but it would be very difficult to verify now, due to a need to search potential distorted/localised alterations of the name. Respublik (talk) 21:11, 30 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, CycloneYoris ^talk! 21:22, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

2024 assassination attempt

2024 assassination attempt → Attempted assassination of Donald Trump (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]

Too general. MSMST1543 (talk) 02:03, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect to List of assassinations or another article. There is no reason to believe that this, only 24ish hours after the news broke, will be the primary topic, and so a redirect should not have been created. I suspect there have also been quite a few attempted assassinations in 2024 that didn't occur in the USA, and so this could also be considered a US centric redirect. Failing a redirect, it should be deleted -bɜ:ʳkənhɪmez (User/say hi!) 02:10, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
As others have pointed out, there isn't really a good redirect target now, so I'm clarifying my !vote to support a disambiguation page being created at this page to list assassination (attempts) in 2024. -bɜ:ʳkənhɪmez (User/say hi!) 03:56, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I am against this redirect. The world doesn't revolve around America and its internal politics. This would perpetuate America-centric systemic bias on the site. JDiala (talk) 02:11, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: I suppose this could be redirected to List of people who survived assassination attempts, though there is only one other attempt in 2024 listed on that article (an attempt on a South Korean MP). Attempted assassination of Donald Trump is clearly the primary topic at this point in the year, and we're not supposed to speculate on if that will change in the future. It is also a very plausible search term. C F A 💬 02:12, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
We aren't supposed to speculate either way. And it's obvious that calling something the primary topic "this point in the year" violates WP:RECENTISM. We don't change, or even create, redirects just because something is what you think is the primary topic right now. -bɜ:ʳkənhɪmez (User/say hi!) 02:17, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sure, you could argue it is recentism, but common sense is also useful here. This was an attempted assassination on a former US president, arguably the most powerful person in the world. It was the first time anything like this happened in more than 40 years. This is not a US news story, it's an international news story. Regardless, I'm not opposed to a redirect to the list. C F A 💬 02:24, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Common sense does not mean US-centric common sense. Your entire argument here is based on a US centric view that the only important assassination (attempt) in 2024 is the one against the former president of the US. And that's why I'm !voting to redirect to another topic or delete. Because that's not a valid argument. -bɜ:ʳkənhɪmez (User/say hi!) 02:32, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
As I pointed out, there were only two assassination attempts in 2024 (so far) notable enough to be included in the list above. It's not really a US-centric approach because an assassination attempt against a former world leader (of arguably the most powerful country in the world) will inherently be more significant than the majority of other attempts, both in the country of origin and internationally. This was a story that was reported in local newspapers around the world. If a former president of South Korea and a congressman in the US were both targeted in assassination attempts, the one against the former president would be the primary topic. This doesn't have much to do with local bias. C F A 💬 02:45, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete or dabify. It's not even the only attempt with its own article in 2024 (Robert Fico). Yet another example of Americentrism. LilianaUwU ^{(talk / contributions)} 02:48, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. I knew I had seen another attempted assassination of a head of state/leader of a country in 2024, but I couldn't pinpoint it. For clarity, this fact should be considered part of my argument above. -bɜ:ʳkənhɪmez (User/say hi!) 02:50, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This is valid argument. I missed Robert Fico because he was not in the list of people who survived assassination attempts. There is no clear primary topic so I change my vote to disambiguate. C F A 💬 02:51, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Disambiguate per Liliana, as Trump is not the only assassination attempt in 2024. Di (they-them) (talk) 03:20, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Disambiguate: Yes, because there have been other attempts on other people, Trump isn't the center of the universe, and Wikipedia should not be so heavily focused on the US perspective etc. 72.14.126.22 (talk) 03:54, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Speedy delete Robert Fico, Lee Jae-Myung, probably a dozen Russian businessmen, Volodymyr Zelenskyy and Mohammed Deif (for the umpteenth time) all can lay claim to that title. The US isn't special in that regard. Bremps... 05:45, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per Bremps, or dabify at List of assassination attempts in 2024 or similar. Rosbif73 (talk) 09:28, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This RfD concerns the fate of the page at the exact name of "2024 assassination attempt". A redirect is defined by its name. An RfD isn't needed to create new pages. About your idea for a new page: A page titled "List of assassination attempts in 2024" would be a list, not a dab. —Alalch E. 11:45, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Disambiguate: as per above comments Lordseriouspig 10:11, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete or disambig per above. This is too general to redirect to a single instance, the attempted assassination of Robert Fico, the prime minister of Slovakia, happened this year too (I've added it to the list article above, no idea why it wasn't there already). Google searches indicate that there have also been (events described as) assassination attempts made on Mohammed Deif and Volodymyr Zelensky at least. Thryduulf (talk) 11:05, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
My addition was reverted because, despite the article title, it isn't a list of people but a list of people who weren't current heads of state or government (the latter having a separate list). See also my proposed merger of the two lists. I oppose retargetting this redirect to either list. Thryduulf (talk) 23:37, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete or retarget to anchor in List of people who survived assassination attempts. I created 2020 assassination attempt to illustrate (I don't think that this redirect and other such redirects are / would be especially good, but this not a WP:POINTed creation, as it is within acceptable bounds from my perspective). Oppose dab. A dab would practically duplicate the list, and WP:NOTDUP does not apply to disambiguation pages when the same content is served in a list (not a different navigation method—the navigation method provided would be essentially the same).—Alalch E. 11:42, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The issue with a redirect is that there are two separate attempted assassination lists: List of people who survived assassination attempts and List of heads of state and government who survived assassination attempts. "2024 assassination attempt" does not refer to either one specifically so a redirect would be completely arbitrary. Thryduulf has proposed these two lists be merged, which I support, but unless that happens a disambiguation page would be the best option. Nothing is duplicated in this case when there are two separate all-time lists. C F A 💬 17:15, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete I agree its too generic since as noted there have been others. Crouch, Swale (talk) 18:12, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per WP:BIAS; search results would handle this fine without needing to manually compile a separate search index, which also would undoubtedly suffer from systemic bias based on several comments here. Ivanvector (^Talk/_Edits) 19:04, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Retarget to List of people who survived assassination attempts where there are two relevant cases --Lenticel ^(talk) 00:14, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
There is a third relevant case at List of heads of state and government who survived assassination attempts, neither is primary over the other. This is why I have (a) proposed merging (please give your input!) and (b) oppose retargetting to either one. Thryduulf (talk) 11:38, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Dabify between the appropriate lists only rather than individuals/specific events. Per nom, the term is to generic to estimate what a person might be searching for, and generally an editor wanting a list of specifics should create, well, such a list with all the relevant requirements fulfilled, but the search term is plausable and spefific enough to have a DAB page to guide them towards locating that specific article. Respublik (talk) 20:54, 30 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - I'm not convinced that the proposed disambiguations or redirections would be consistently helpful to reader, in part due to the vagueness of "attempt". Search results seem safer than compiling an ad hoc set index of assassination attempts in 2024. _signed,Rosguill ^talk 19:39, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, CycloneYoris ^talk! 20:39, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete or retarget to a dab page for assassination attempts in 2024. - Worthlessly vague and too US-centric. Just ask any PIA regulars. —Jéské Couriano v^_^v ^{threads critiques} 18:35, 2 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Ambiguous and likely to cause confusion. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 15:02, 4 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, basically per Rosguill. -- asilvering (talk) 01:59, 6 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Chilodontidae-stub

Template:Chilodontidae-stub → Template:Chilodontaidae-gastropod-stub (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]

Unused. Chilodontidae is a former spelling (now regarded as incorrect) for a gastropod family. Chilodontidae is a current, correct spelling for a fish family. See the Chilodontidae dab page. Template redirect uses the spelling for the fish family to redirect to a stub sorting template for the gastropod family Plantdrew (talk) 02:00, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Did you mean that Chilodontidae is a current, correct spelling for a fish family? jlwoodwa (talk) 01:51, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Whoops, yes. Fixed the spelling above. Plantdrew (talk) 19:51, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, _signed,Rosguill ^talk 19:28, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

German Expressionist

German Expressionist → German expressionist cinema (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]
German expressionist → German expressionist cinema (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]
German Expressionists → German expressionist cinema (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]
German Expressionism → Expressionism#In Germany and Austria (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]
German expressionism → German expressionist cinema (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]

German expressionist cinema is a film movement that emerged from a German expressionist movement in the visual arts. I think the best solutions would either be retargeting to Expressionism, since it's more broadly defined to include cinema and other media, or turn German expressionism/German Expressionism into a disambiguation page. hinnk (talk) 18:51, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Since we lack an article on the topic, all of these should align with German Expressionism and target Expressionism#In_Germany_and_Austria. German expressionism can be tagged as a {{r with possibilities}}. - Eureka Lott 14:54, 3 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
In which case the other redirects should be marked as {{R avoided double redirect}} of the one with possibilities so they get retargetted when the article is written. Thryduulf (talk) 16:58, 3 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Skeletor (Marvel Comics)

Skeletor (Marvel Comics) → Taskmaster (character) (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]

honestly, not even nominating this to see it deleted or retargeted to some actual instance of skeletor in a marvel comic (i didn't find any, but i'm not that good at looking, so eh), i'm just doing it because it's funny. not a common comparison from what i've seen though cogsan _{(nag me) (stalk me)} 18:04, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - I would not be surprised if Taskmaster's usual nemesis used this name to insult him given his usual appearance takes some cues from Skeletor, but the Masters of the Universe comics were never done by Marvel - they were done by DC Comics. —Jéské Couriano v^_^v ^{threads critiques} 18:40, 2 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Le Cartel

Le Cartel → Mother Russia Bleeds (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]
Le Cartel Studio → Mother Russia Bleeds (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]

These redirects should be deleted. The developer's name and a typo are being redirected to its first notable game; the article itself mentions the developer's history but the redirect is barely used outside of articles for its games as well as game list articles. I do not believe it will be used enough to deserve a redirect of its own, like most other independent developers with notable games with their own articles. MimirIsSmart (talk) 06:05, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: the article itself mentions the developer's history is ample reason to keep the redirect. You could at most argue WP:XY because the studio's other game, Heave Ho, also has an article. A typo is not in sight. IceWelder [✉] 10:10, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Su85b

Su85b → SU-85 (talk · links · history · stats) [ Closure: keep/retarget/delete ]

No mention on the target page. The tank does appear to be real though, so maybe a mention could be added to the article? Only source I can find on it though is an article on a website called "Warspot" that doesn't seem to have much fact checking. ― Blaze Wolf^Talk_{blaze__wolf} 04:19, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's definitely a thing, even though most of the many English-language hits relate to its appearance in World of Tanks (most commonly rendered as "SU-85b" the hyphenless version does get plenty of hits) it is not just we have a picture at File:СУ-85Б.webp which led to my discovering the Russian and Ukrainian Wikipedias have articles about it. There is a mention at List of armoured fighting vehicles by country#Soviet Union, but that doesn't say more than that it was based on the SU-76 prototype; SU-76#Variants has a sentence. Draft:SU-85B was deleted under G13 in 2020, but it was just a single sentence "The SU-85B was a prototype Soviet tank destroyer based on the SU-76.". If we decide not to delete this then SU-85B should be created as a redirect to the same target, but what target that would be or whether deletion per WP:REDLINK would be better I don't know. Thryduulf (talk) 10:55, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Retarget to SU-76 where it is mentioned as a variant. Schützenpanzer (Talk) 13:52, 1 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]