Talk:Vice presidency of Al Gore

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public opinion, his rep during office?

Nothing about the public opinion of him during his vice-presidency? From what I recall he was portrayed as an idiot, by the media at least, and it shaped what I knew of him in Canada. He made some widely repeated quotes that branded him as not much of a thinker. Sure, public opinion changed after Inconvenient Truth, but is it not a matter of record? 142.25.141.94 (talk) 15:41, 30 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Proposed move

The following is a closed discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was move all per clear consensus in discussion below. --regentspark (comment) 15:51, 21 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

– Presidency and other derivatives are not a proper noun. The use of the possessive is also unideal. This new format is consistent with presidency of Barack Obama. A Sarah Palin vice presidential candidacy format, which is consistent with articles like Barack Obama presidential campaign, 2008, would also be acceptable. Also maybe worth deciding here is whether vice presidential needs a hyphen. Some articles do, some don't. Marcus Qwertyus (talk) 19:00, 26 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Support viaWP:MOSCAPS. Srsrox (talk) 17:32, 28 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Comment – See also Talk:Timeline of the presidency of Barack Obama. I'm a little uncomfortable with this, seems disrespectful of the offices, advise a "go slow" approach to further edits of this sort until there is an unquestionably broad consensus on this matter. What I'm hearing here is that there is a difference between (former) Vice President Al Gore and Vice presidency of Al Gore? Wbm1058 (talk) 19:21, 28 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Comment – Review articles in Category:Presidencies of the United States (part of Category:United States presidential administrations) for consistency. The Gore article seems to be unique among veeps (so far), although the current VP has Office of the Vice President.
- Presidency of Barack Obama: "The Presidency of Barack Obama began at noon..." – article capitalizes Presidency in lead sentence
- Presidency of George W. Bush: "The presidency of George W. Bush began on..." – doesn't capitalize it
- Presidency of Bill Clinton: "The United States Presidency of Bill Clinton, also known as the Clinton administration, was the executive branch of the federal government of the United States from..." – capitalizes Presidency, and precedes it with "United States", clearly referring to a specific Presidency (of the US) rather than a generic presidency (of anything)
- Presidency of George H. W. Bush – a redirect
- Presidency of Ronald Reagan: "The United States presidency of Ronald Reagan, also known as the Reagan administration, was a Republican administration headed by Ronald Reagan from..." – doesn't capitalize it

—Wbm1058 (talk) 22:02, 28 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Support per WP:NCCAPS and recent RM outcome of Presidency of Barack Obama. --BDD (talk) 19:45, 29 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not finding any RM discussions at talk:Presidency of Barack Obama, and the lead sentence of that article capitalizes Presidency. Wikipedia:JOBTITLES is the section of Wikipedia's Manual of Style which applies here: Offices... such as president... are capitalized... When followed by a person's name, when they can be considered to have become part of the name: President Nixon, not president Nixon. When used in the form Presidency of Barack Obama, with the mere transformation of the title word and insertion of "of" between the title and the name, we are not unquestionably removed from "considered to have become part of the name". If you say we are, then would you object to "presidency of President Barack Obama"? – Wbm1058 (talk) 01:07, 30 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Pardon me. I meant to refer to Timeline of the presidency of Barack Obama and its year-by-year sub-articles. I'd only object to the phrase you mention due to its redundancy. --BDD (talk) 01:25, 30 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Exactly. Because it would be redundant to say it that way, we simplify it and eliminate the redundancy by keeping capital Presidency of...

Regarding the example you gave over at Talk:Timeline of the presidency of Barack Obama, I wouldn't put much weight on an opinion piece with the term "Failed Presidency" in the title. Lowercase presidency here can just be viewed as a means of showing disrespect for the man holding the office, as capitalizing Obama Doctrine, a term often used in a derogatory sense, is another piece of disrespect. Is there an Obama doctrine? Clearly, this writer's manual of style is not consistent with Wikipedia's. – Wbm1058 (talk) 01:37, 30 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose, per Talk:List of Presidents of the United States#Requested move and Talk:List of Federal Presidents of Austria#Requested move – If we can't even get consensus for lower-casing president when it is used generically, then we certainly should not consider lowercase when usage is tied to a specific President or Vice President. – Wbm1058 (talk) 16:14, 30 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Support, words from the "president" word family are capitalised way too often. Let's finally stop it and decap it when used as a general noun. The Evil IP address (talk) 11:10, 31 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Question for those in support of this move: would you also support:
- List of Vice Presidents of the United States → List of vice presidents of the United States
If not, please explain the difference. Thanks, Wbm1058 (talk) 17:21, 1 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

No. "Vice President of the United States" is a title. In dictionary-ese, "vice presidency" is the state or quality of being a vice president. The vice presidency of Al Gore constitutes the time in which he was the Vice President of the United States. I'm not just making this up. See Merriam-Webster or Wiktionary. --BDD (talk) 18:12, 1 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

OK. That's helpful, though more specific usage examples would be even better. I see we have categories:

The first two use a big-P and the third uses a small-p, yet the only difference between them otherwise is that the third example appends -related lists – are any of these wrong? Wbm1058 (talk) 20:19, 1 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Comment on candidacy articles. We have:
- Category:United States vice-presidential candidates, 2012 (Ryan)
- Category:United States vice-presidential candidates, 2008 (Palin)
- Palin and Ryan are perhaps the only two so far with articles devoted entirely to their VP candidacies
- Category:United States presidential campaigns, 2012
- Mitt Romney presidential campaign, 2012
- Category:United States presidential campaigns, 2008
- Mitt Romney presidential campaign, 2008
- From this pattern,
  - Sarah Palin's Vice Presidential candidacy → Sarah Palin vice presidential candidacy, 2008
  - Paul Ryan's Vice Presidential candidacy → Paul Ryan vice presidential candidacy, 2012

—Wbm1058 (talk) 01:12, 2 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Support all. There is currently a complete lack of consistency, but this proposal is a step forward. Capitalise the title, but not the office. The others that don't conform to this should all be changed in time. Andrewa (talk) 12:43, 5 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

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