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At present this article is almost entirely a laundry list of criticisms and contains very little useful encyclopedic information on the government and its policies. I also note that the references are entirely editorial in nature and contain no academic sources (and the latter do exist). --Tyrannus Mundi (talk) 15:14, 28 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Agree. I copyedited this mess and reorged it, but even though the individual points are now framed relatively neutrally, the overall tenor of the article is unrelenting in its bias. Lfstevens (talk) 23:23, 13 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Merger proposal

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The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
The result of this discussion was merge D O N D E groovily Talk to me 01:54, 12 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Per my comment here, I propose that Public image of Lee Myung-bak be merged into this article: I do not see that there is anything worthwhile in that article that cannot be stated briefly on this page (and in many cases it already is stated here). --— Tyrannus Mundi 21:38, 27 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Agree PBJT (talk) 05:30, 28 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]
no Disagree The Korean version stated criticisms against 2MB before he was a president. You can eventually put a lot of academic sources later. I don't like how there's a lot of pro-American bias these days in any article pertaining to Korean politics. And it's quite disturbing to see many active Korean(-American) contributors. Komitsuki (talk) 14:03, 17 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

As the main contributor to the Public image of Lee Myung-bak, I can understand why you oppose to this proposal. But I'm of the opinion that much of the "Public Image" article overlaps with "Lee Myung-bak government". Sections like Administration Issues, Media freedoms, Economic Failure, Stance on North Korea and Ignoring Pledges are policy-related contents, all of which can be dealt within the scope of "Lee Myung-bak government". I think there could be two possible solutions:

  1. Significantly trim down the Public image of Lee Myung-bak such that it focuses on "Public image of Lee". Lee's negative (Rat, 2MB) or positive(?) (Bulldozer) nicknames/images can be included in this article. Some cultural/social impact of Lee Myung-bak and his government, , such as Naneun Ggomsuda podcast, can be included as well.
  2. Include relevant contents of "Public image" in the Lee Myung-bak. I found that "Lee Myung-bak" article already has In popular culture and Public image subsection. Many political leaders article in English Wikipedia have a sub-section dealing with the leader's "Public image", but not many have a "Public image" article dedicated to their public perception. Your example of "Korean wiki has an article on same topic" doesn't convincing to me: Korean wiki doesn't have Public image of Barack Obama, while English wiki has one.

I think second option is better, because if you exclude all the policy section, not much contents left to be a seperate article. Either way, we should separate government policy from Lee's public image. --- PBJT (talk) 21:16, 17 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Let me add one more thing: I think Kim Dae-jung, a Nobel Peace Prize laureate, is most widely known South Korean President because of his dedication to the country's Democratization and Sun-Shine policy. Where's the public image of Kim Dae-jung in Korean or English Wikipedia? Where's public image of Roh Moo-hyun or all the other Korean president? Or where's the public image of notorious dictator Kim Jung-il? Then, why Lee Myung-bak, unless you have your own agenda? --- PBJT (talk) 00:12, 19 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Blame me. If my contributions are all garbage, I think you have the privilege to hate me so much. Maybe I should accept this bad treatment from you. I started to enrich any content on South Korean politics because there were very little. Why do I paint South Korean conservatives bad? It's because conservatives in any USA-influenced Asian countries are turning very bad. I don't like it. America has corrupted South Korean conservatism. Somebody needs to fix this problem with a help of a small man like me. So call me bad names because I did something very wrong according to you and others. Mock me with horrible name-calling if you want. I deserve it. I have no faith in Korea and Koreans because from my experience all Koreans except for Korean-Filipino/as will treat me like a non-person. Komitsuki (talk) 13:11, 19 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Don't take it personal and be emotional. I don't know much about you so as to hate or like you. I'm only commenting your contributions in Public image of Lee Myung-bak, and I think you have violated WP:POV, WP:OR and WP:Copyrights in that article. I have trimmed down the Public image article, so please let me know if I recklessly removed your contributions. I still think "Public image" article should be merged into "Lee Myung-bak government" or "Lee Myung-bak". --- PBJT (talk) 03:08, 20 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
As I've pointed out previously Komitsuki, Wikipedia does not generally favour the existence of articles dedicated to criticism, particularly of living people (WP:CRITICISM and more importantly WP:CFORK: "Wikipedia articles should not be split into multiple articles solely so each can advocate a different stance on the subject"). Furthermore, creating articles solely because you don't like a subject and want to illustrate your POV rather than providing neutral information is agenda editing, viz.: "Although some topics, particularly those concerning current affairs and politics, may stir passions and tempt people to "climb soapboxes" (for example, passionately advocate their pet point of view), Wikipedia is not the medium for this." --Tyrannus Mundi (talk) 01:16, 21 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks a lot Tyrannus Mundi for elegantly summarized the whole problem! I want to add one more thing: Komitsuki created the Public image of Lee Myung-bak by splitting contents from Lee Myung-bak, which he shouldn't do in the first place. Compare this edit from the initial version of Public image. This was the reason why much of Public image's scope overlapped with Lee Myung-bak and Lee Myung-bak government. --- PBJT (talk) 22:00, 22 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

plus Added It's been a month since the merge was proposed. I think we should close the discussion now since no one object to the proposal, and finalized the merge. Any suggestions? --- PBJT (talk) 14:34, 2 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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