Talk:Goat cheese

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Bertille Jacquart.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 22:30, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

Goats' cheese?

Where is goats' cheese from. I think goat's cheese is fine but possessive in plural looks really odd. It suggests that you needed to mix milk from different goats to obtain it.Mikolasj (talk) 09:42, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

On a second thought, even goat's cheese is dubious. I believe that goat's milk means milk from a goat but the cheese is not really from the goat (only the milk is). So goat cheese is probably the most correct term as it specifies the kind of the cheese. Mikolasj (talk) 18:26, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

I agree that the possessive form is inappropriate. The goat does not own the cheese, neither is the cheese an essential property of the goat, as in "flower's scent." As an amateur goat fromager, I always use the term "goat milk" and "goat milk cheese" instead of the possessive form. — Bytesmiths (talk) 17:02, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

You misunderstand the apostrophe as used here. It is not possessive but genitive. It has nothing to do with ownership but rather that the cheese pertains to (the milk of) a goat. 'Milk' is understood here but not written. Using 'goat cheese' does not solve the alleged problem, since it can be misinterpreted in exactly the same way - the cheese is not made from a goat nor does the cheese come from the goat! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thomani9 (talk • contribs) 14:32, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

I find the above explanation dubious, but I don't think it'd be beneficial to get into a long debate about grammar. No one is taught linguistics in school, they're taught "grammar" instead so it's hard to have a rational argument on the subject. Instead, can we appeal to precedent? That is, whatever seems to be more logical to you is irrelevant as language isn't logical and doesn't always obey the rules you set up to try to describe it. Instead, I'd rather look at industry documents (FDA, large manufacturers) and use whatever form they use. 72.161.91.140 (talk) 00:47, 12 October 2013 (UTC)

Nutritional Information

Think we should add some. Apparently chevre is good for people with sensitive stomachs as it is easy to digest. 364 calories per 100 grams. It contains short-chain fatty acids, etc.... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.69.198.244 (talk) 08:45, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

The article currently contradicts itself "Although cow's milk and goat's milk have similar overall fat contents" "Because goat milk is leaner than that of cows, goat cheese tends to be leaner as well" Jray14upa (talk) 23:00, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

The section below "China" is wrong regarding fat content. Goat milk will tend to have more fat that cow milk, but there is greater variation among breeds than there is between cow and goat. For example, a Gurnsey cow will have higher fat milk than a French Alpine goat, but a Nubian goat will have much higher fat content than a Holstein cow. Our Nubians measure out at nearly 8% -- over twice the fat content of standardized cow milk (3%)! — Bytesmiths (talk) 16:30, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

I'm not sure it was the right template to add, but I just added the advertisement template because this section has an awful lot of unsourced material about how great dairy products are for your health. It strays pretty far from the topic of goat cheese. John W (talk) 06:03, 20 September 2009 (UTC)

Article title

Is goats' cheese really known as "chèvre cheese"? Perhaps this is a United States usage (on a par with the American habit of referring to snails, when eaten, as "escargots")? -- Picapica 22:33, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

I don't think it's a U.S. usage. Around here, we call it "goats' milk cheese". This probably ought to be disambiguated anyway. There are several cheeses made from goats' milk. --GentlemanGhost 20:28, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

I have often heard goat's milk cheese simply referred to as chevre, although this usage is not as common as "goat cheese." "Chevre cheese" is never used. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.185.234.24 (talk) 16:52, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Why the brand name mentions?

It doesn't add anything to the article to name brands of goat cheese in two select countried. I don't feel strongly enough about it to change it, though. TobyCallahan 02:07, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

I removed the bit about the USA cheeses. The other cheeses mentioned are named for their regional characteristics, they are not name brands or specific companies. The info about Humboldt Fog under the USA was blatant advertising. If someone has legitimate info about USA goat cheese varieties then they should put up a USA subheading. --K 10 23:17, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

The Humboldt Fog add is still there. We should be frank, the USA has done nothing inovative in regards to Goats cheese. There are great makers but nothing new. J

The US' main innovation in cheese is to bulk it up with wood pulp. 194.207.86.26 (talk) 15:50, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

WikiProject class rating

This article was automatically assessed because at least one article was rated and this bot brought all the other ratings up to at least that level. BetacommandBot 03:33, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

ADVERTISEMENT

This article reads like a frickin' advertisement. Somebody please edit the crap out of it please!!!

I removed all the text that I could immediately identify as plagiarism from the International Dairy Farmers' Association. I suspect there may be more plagiarism present, but with everyone and their cousin aggregating Wikipedia content, it's hard to tell where the circle of quotations starts. I also removed a link from the reference section that had no non-advertising point. - PianoDan (talk) 19:04, 3 December 2009 (UTC)

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was move per request.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 23:22, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

Follow-up note: already moved by another without closing this discussion, and without doing any of the required cleanup.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 23:27, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

---

Goat milk cheese → Goat cheese — By an enormous margin, the overwhelmingly more common term for the cheese. Hits at least four of the five criteria at WP:MOSNAME, with the sole possible exception of "precision", though there is no plausible concern that many people would think "goat cheese" is made of goats rather than goats' milk. --^Bongo_matic 01:23, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

• Support Clearly most common name. Also more natural and concise (per WP:TITLE) and no less precise. Finally, it's obviously the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC which is confirmed by the fact that Goat cheese already redirects here. --Born2cycle (talk) 01:48, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
• Support per all of the above. –CWenger (talk) 02:15, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
• Support. Goat cheese seems to be the most common name, but that's because it is most common in the United States. In the UK it is usually known as goat's cheese, although it is occasionally referred to as goat cheese. Goat milk cheese, or goat's milk cheese, is a less common name. "Goat cheese" is preferred, either as the most common name, or (if different varieties of English are relevant) as the article is written in American English. Peter E. James (talk) 10:57, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
• Oppose - "goat cheese"? That would be cheese made out of goats! Deb (talk) 18:40, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

I think the average person would realize that Goat Cheese is not made from Goats even if we use the proposed term. I don't think we should avoid using Goat Cheese any more that we should not use the term head cheese on the grounds that people may think that it is cheese made from heads.--76.66.189.59 (talk) 21:47, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

If the above comment is intended to be ironic, could the commentator please strike through the opinion? If not, the reasoning is fallacious for several reasons. First, grammatically, a noun followed by another noun doesn't always denote an instance of the latter made from the former (a "desk lamp" is not a lamp made out of a desk)—any number of relationships between the two nouns may be in evidence. Second, "goat cheese" means cheese made out of goats' milk, parsing aside. A quick review of cookbooks, websites, or any literature that touches on the subject will establish this immediately. ^Bongo_matic 01:13, 17 March 2011 (UTC)

So you assume that I am making a facetious comment just because I disagree? I have heard the term "Goat's cheese" in the UK, but never "Goat cheese". And I have never heard of "head cheese either". Deb (talk) 15:52, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

I made no such assumption—I thought it was a possibility given how uninformed was the proffered opinion. Wikipedia's content and style is based on verifiable facts and usage, not on any editor's personal experience. I determined what phrase was most prevalent by doing Google book searches—not a perfect methodology, but one that establishes without any doubt the result. It is also a methodology that would reveal the meaning of (and prevalence of the term) "head cheese". ^Bongo_matic 17:02, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

By the way, what you call "head cheese" is made of heads. Deb (talk) 18:16, 20 March 2011 (UTC)

Yes, but it's not cheese, yet Head cheese remains the title.

Bongomatic is correct. Any argument in opposition to this move based on "I never heard of it" or "'goat cheese' would be 'cheese made out of goats'" should be discounted not because it is an oppose, but because the oppose is based on a JDLI argument; see WP:JDLI#Title_discussions. --Born2cycle (talk) 22:35, 20 March 2011 (UTC)

I'm afraid you're missing the point. The user who was actually discussing this with me argued about the use of "goat" as an adjective - the discussion had nothing to do with the noun "cheese". Deb (talk) 12:52, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

There is nothing wrong with using "goat" as a noun adjunct. --Born2cycle (talk) 17:57, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

• Support although "Goats' cheese" might be slightly better as a more natural term. 86.6.193.43 (talk) 23:36, 20 March 2011 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Questionable edits excluding Israel

In these edits [1][2] two users (or possibly the same user) seem to be excluding Israel from the list of cheeses. In the previous version of this article Israel had its own heading, with labneh being listed underneath. In the first change of this information, Tonychakar changes the heading to a range of nations, none of which include Israel, though the nations surround Israel. This looks very much like a POV edit. Since I do not think in any way that Israel is the origin nation of labneh, or that they are the only nation that uses labneh, I changed the heading to Eastern Mediterranean to be more inclusive of all nations. (I still question whether any one nation can be credited with labneh) In the second change by IP 178.135.194.237, the heading was changed to The Levant, with choice nations being added to the heading as a parenthetical. Again, Israel is not included. These seem like unnecessary changes that don't provide an accurate representation of where labneh is used. For these reasons, I have reverted to a more general regional heading. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 19:30, 11 February 2015 (UTC)

Proposed merge of Properties, fabrication and specificities of goat cheese

Two pages on the same topic, with overlapping content. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 20:42, 20 December 2016 (UTC)

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Goat cheese processing, regulations and food microbiology

Hello, We are a group of university students who would like to explore the processing, regulations and food microbiology as they pertain to goat cheese. If you would like to contribute some information, these are a few of the questions we will be answering. 1) How is goat cheese made and what are the processing steps necessary for proper/safe storage and/or packaging? 2) What kind of microorganism are likely to grow in goat cheese and how do we prevent their growth? 3) What diseases can be passed on from the animal to human consumers? 4) What are the Canadian regulations?

Here are the sources we will be using: -Buffa, M., et al. “Microbiological Changes throughout Ripening of Goat Cheese Made from Raw, Pasteurized and High-Pressure-Treated Milk.” Food Microbiology, vol. 18, no. 1, 2001, pp. 45–51. -how it's made -http://laws.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/C.R.C.,_c._870/page-40.html#h-71 http://laws.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/C.R.C.,_c._870/page-44.html#docCont http://laws.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/C.R.C.,_c._870/page-43.html#docCont

-Högberg, M., et al. "Milk Processing Quality of suckled/milked Goats: Effects of Milk Accumulation Interval and Milking Regime." The Journal of Dairy Research, vol. 83, no. 2, 2016, pp. 173-179. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zhinazl2 (talk • contribs) 19:06, 26 July 2018 (UTC)

Food science course at UBC

Hello Fellow Wikipedia editors,

On behalf of my fellow student team enrolled in an introductory food science course at UBC, we would like to use our newly learned food science knowledge to enhance this article on Goat Cheese. In particular, we are interested in exploring and contributing to processing, nutrition and health, and a bit about Canada. We will continue to post our outlines and drafts on this sandbox https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/User:Vickypeng23/sandbox. We welcome all comments and feedback. We look forward to contributing to Wikipedia via this course assignment.

Signed, Vicky Peng Vivia Ding Morton Chen Robert Hechler Nik Trifonov — Preceding unsigned comment added by Vickypeng23 (talk • contribs) 17:46, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

@Vickypeng23: Hi there and welcome. Best of luck in your project. We'd love to see references as well, so please be sure to see Referencing for Beginners. There is a built-in tool in the editing window under Cite that makes it easy to cite stuff. Of lesser importance, please note that new comments go at the bottom of the page, and if you would please sign your posts with four tildes like ~~~~ it will append your signature and a time stamp like this: → Cyphoidbomb (talk) 17:57, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

Sorry, that should have said "if you would please sign your talk page posts". We don't sign our edits. Thanks, Cyphoidbomb (talk) 17:57, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

Copyright problem removed

Prior content in this article duplicated one or more previously published sources. The material was copied from: http://www.everything-goat-milk.com/goat-cheese-making.html. Copied or closely paraphrased material has been rewritten or removed and must not be restored, unless it is duly released under a compatible license. (For more information, please see "using copyrighted works from others" if you are not the copyright holder of this material, or "donating copyrighted materials" if you are.)

For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or published material; such additions will be deleted. Contributors may use copyrighted publications as a source of information, and, if allowed under fair use, may copy sentences and phrases, provided they are included in quotation marks and referenced properly. The material may also be rewritten, providing it does not infringe on the copyright of the original or plagiarize from that source. Therefore, such paraphrased portions must provide their source. Please see our guideline on non-free text for how to properly implement limited quotations of copyrighted text. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously, and persistent violators will be blocked from editing. While we appreciate contributions, we must require all contributors to understand and comply with these policies. Thank you. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 22:44, 9 August 2019 (UTC)

Daily consumption of Neu5Gc (for which goat cheese is a good source) might be a serious risk for humans

According to this table:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC218710/bin/pnas_2131556100v2_index.html

goat cheese contains 39.9/6.4= 6.2 times the Neu5Gc compared to Cow cheese. The number would be 1.0 if they contained the same amounts per weight.

...

https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/N-Glycolylneuraminic_acid

https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/Talk:N-Glycolylneuraminic_acid

Possible risks: cardiovascular risk and hepatocarcinoma. No increased risk: colon cancer.

Hepatocarcinoma: the most common type of primary liver cancer in adults and is currently the most common cause of death in people with cirrhosis.

https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/Hepatocellular_carcinoma

--ee1518 (talk) 10:21, 20 July 2021 (UTC)

==Wiki Education assignment: Information Literacy and Scholarly Discourse== This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 26 January 2022 and 21 May 2022. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Jayde1974 (article contribs). Peer reviewers: Wikiwikichrissy, DylCunn.

— Assignment last updated by Mlclark1 (talk) 13:23, 10 June 2022 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Information Literacy and Scholarly Discourse

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 15 August 2022 and 30 November 2022. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Simeonkirk (article contribs).

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Wiki Education assignment: Information Literacy and Scholarly Discourse

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 23 January 2023 and 19 May 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Peer reviewers: FabiolaUNO, Karynabaez.

— Assignment last updated by Msanfor1 (talk) 17:41, 9 October 2023 (UTC)

Add more sources on the Regional Varieties

I think this is a great article, it is very informative and easy to understand. The main topic is well-written and the sources are there. I just feel like it would be very useful if the Regional Varieties section had more cited sources. It is a lot of information, so I think this could be very hard for the time we have left for this assignment, but it is worth trying.

FabiolaUNO (talk) 23:38, 17 April 2023 (UTC)