Talk:2022 FIFA World Cup/GA2

GA Review

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Reviewer: Zwerg Nase (talk · contribs) 07:48, 16 August 2023 (UTC)

1. It is reasonably well written.

   a (prose): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):

2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.

   a (reference section): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR):

3. It is broad in its coverage.

   a (major aspects): b (focused):

4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.

   Fair representation without bias:

5. It is stable.

   No edit wars, etc.:

6. It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.

   a (images are tagged and non-free content have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):

7. Overall:

   Pass/Fail:

Lead

• Every information in the lead should also be part of the article itself. I would therefore suggest to include the stat on highest amount of goals down in the statistics section. Then also move the source there, since the source is then not needed in the lead.
  • Moved ref to body. With how it's dealt with by the wikiproject, this was the best way to format it Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 19:11, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

Scope

• The infobox includes number of attendance, but without a source. I suggest adding a section in the article body on ticketing and attendance, then source the numbers there.
  • So I can't say I agree with this, but this is simply an addition of the individual attendances from each of the matches (you can see the amounts in the infobox). There's an argument that WP:CALC comes into play, but I'm not a fan of adding something without any cites (most sources talk about the 3 million or so that attended the world cup, but not necessarily the matches. I'd be hesitant to add to the body without an overall cite. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 19:17, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

I see, I guess that works. Zwerg Nase (talk) 08:36, 7 September 2023 (UTC)

Overview

• Overview is not really the best name for this section, since it does not cover all aspects of the article. I would suggest "Background".
  • I think Overview is apt, but I prefer "format" to "background". Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 19:21, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
• The moving of the Qatar-Ecuador match is mentioned twice, once is enough.
  • Removed one entry Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 19:21, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

Host selection

• A lot here in the criticism section here doubles with the "Controversies" section further down. Any chance to merge them in one place?
  • I have merged these. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 19:48, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
• "Despite convictions and guilty pleas of accepting bribes, FIFA ultimately elected not to change the host site." Missing a source.
  • Removed. Don't really need to say it, because it's obvious the event took place there if we are talking about it. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 19:48, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

Venues

• The entire paragraph on how much which stadiums were used is unsourced.
  • Removed. Not sure it's needed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 19:51, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
• The caption on the Al Bayt Stadium is still phrased in future tense. Has the dismantling not been done yet?
  • Changed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 19:51, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
• The team base camps table needs a source.
  • It was cited to the refs above it, but I've made it more obvious. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 19:52, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
• The security bit appears twice, please merge.
  • Deleted first mention. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 19:52, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

Teams

• "France, the reigning World Cup champions also went through qualifying stages as normal." This sentence only makes sense if it is explained that defending champions used to not have to qualify. Maybe in a footnote?
  • Yeah, I don't think that's ever been the case (well, other than where there was no qualification). I've reworded to avoid.Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:04, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
• Could reasons be given why Saint Lucia, Samoa, and American Samoa withdrew?
  • The old C19. Saint Lucia no one knows [1] Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:04, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
• "As a result, the 2022 tournament was the first World Cup in which none of the teams that earned a spot through qualification were making their debut. The Netherlands, Ecuador, Ghana, Cameroon, and the United States returned to the tournament after missing the 2018 tournament." Both of these statements are unsourced.
  • Seems like StatCruft to me. Removed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:04, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
• "who decided not to replace Karim Benzema after he sustained an injury" - my French is not great, but I think the French source does not explicitly state this.
  • That is what happened, but the source does say 25 for both teams, so I've avoided Benzemas item. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:07, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
• Footnotes on teams not determined at the time of the draw should include a source, #130 should suffice, though I would love to see a more explicit source here, since the FIFA source does not clearly state which teams have not been determined yet.
  • Added. The note itself just says that the teams weren't known when the draw took place. I've cited the draw instead. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:10, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

Officiating

• I am not in love with the tweet (or is it an X not?) as a source. I am sure a better source can be found for this.
  • Who knows with that Trainwreck. As much as Twitter is the wildwest, it's a tweet from FIFA, so it's reliable. I can't find too much press about them actually being announced as the ref for the final.Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:12, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

Group stage

Group A

• "Many Qatar natives were seen leaving the game before the end, with ESPN reporting that two-thirds of the attendance had left." Not sure if this is really relevant, maybe under controversies (see below later once I get to that part)
  • I dunno, it's either relevant enough here, or not at all. It's not really a controversy that people left, but it is noteworthy. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:13, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

Group B

• "England completed a 6–2 victory over Iran." - completed sounds odd, this sentence could simply be "England beat Iran 6-2"?
  • It could, but that gets a bit repetitive. Used this wording for some flavour. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:19, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "and two by Rashford" - Rashford has not been mentioned yet, so full name and wikilink here.
  • Linked. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:19, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Group C

• "the biggest upset in the history of the World Cup" - this is a direct quote, but I cannot find it in any of the two given sources??
  • Removed as a quote and made it less definitive. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:22, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Group E

• Feel like the Germany-Japan match could use a better source to back up the fact that it was indeed an "upset".
  • Removed that word, as I feel we'd need to attribute it. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:24, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• It is noteworthy I believe to point out that four-time World Champions Germany exited in the Group Stages for the second time in a row.
  • Added Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:24, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Group F

• "Belgium manager Roberto Martínez confirmed after the game that he believed Canada to have been the better team." - This sentence can be scrapped, not really relevant, the other games also do not state who might have been the better team, which is pure speculation anyway.
  • Removed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:26, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "The match sparked riots in Belgium, with residents fires and fireworks being set off." - residents fires? What is that?
  • Reworded. Clearly badly written. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:26, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Group G

• "with star player Neymar receiving an ankle injury" - receiving sounds like he got it as a gift or something.
  • Well, it was given to him by another player. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:32, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Maybe suffered? Zwerg Nase (talk) 08:43, 7 September 2023 (UTC)

• "He was later sent off for removing his shirt in celebrating the goal." - This needs context, explain why players can be sent off for this.
  • Yellow cards are given to players for removing the shirt (this has been a worldwide rule for almost 20 years now). He was already on a yellow card. I have added this, but I don't want to unnecessarily explain that you can get a yellow for this behaviour as it would probably bloat the prose. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:32, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

I think it's better that way since these articles should be written in a way that people not familiar with the subject matter can understand them.Zwerg Nase (talk) 08:43, 7 September 2023 (UTC)

• "The game's first goal appeared to have been headed in by Ronaldo, but the ball just missed his head." - Also not that relevant.
  • Removed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:32, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "Several Uruguay players left the pitch after the game surrounding the referees and followed them off the pitch." - could also do with some context, controversial non-given penalty late on?
  • Well, realistically they were unhappy about not qualifying. I wouldn't want to claim motives. It's important enough as players did get bans for this. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:32, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Knockout stage

• "their biggest win margin in the 2022 tournament, reaching their sixth final" - both statements are not backed up by the source given.
  • Removed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:35, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "This marked their third World Cup win and their first since 1986. It also marked the first time that a South American team won the World Cup in 20 years and as Copa América champions." - unsourced!
  • Removed - sourced part.

Statistics

• As mentioned above, overall goal statistics should be added here with the respective source.
  • I've moved this - it looks a bit weird due to the formatting. I'm not au fait with the template enough to know how to fix it. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:40, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• Discipline: if there is no source available for this table, then I would recommend scrapping this completely.
  • I agree. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:40, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Awards

• Five sources here seem excessive, any chance to merge them?
  • Bundled. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:45, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• The information on assists and minutes played for the Golden Ball are not backed up by a source.
  • Removed Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:45, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• Move source on goal of the tournament to end of paragraph.
  • done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:45, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Marketing

• "FanSided" seems like a dodgy source at best to me.
  • Removed Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:54, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "coloured borders "parallels"" - what is a parallel??
  • Reworded to explain. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:54, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• Broadcasting: Why is Fox Sports in the US singled out for information about how their coverage was received? I am sure these discussions happened in other countries (definitely here in Germany), so why are they not covered? Either include as much as possible or leave it out entirely. I see no reason to single out the US, a nation not even that much into football.
• Broadcasting: Same with the licensing and the viewership numbers? Why is only the US covered here??
  • I've removed these bits. I agree that we need to be more worldwide and this isn't very important pieces. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:54, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Symbols

• "Social media commentary compared La'eeb's appearance to Casper the Friendly Ghost or the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man, or even the ghost of the construction workers who died building the stadiums and infrastructure." - scrap for relevance, also, all four sources are highly questionable.
  • Removed - agreed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:58, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "for promoting the world cup" - capital letters on World Cup.
  • Done. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:58, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "performed by American rapper Lil Baby, teamed up with Budweiser" - Budweiser was rapping?? Like the entire company?
  • Wow, can't believe that obvious advertising was still there. Gone now. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:58, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Controversies

• Generally, this section again suffers from the problem that some issues are brought up in the opening paragraphs and then are covered again in their respective subsections, leading to information being there twice.
  • Luckily from earlier in the review, I've removed some redundancy with the rest of the article. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• Source order should be taken care of, for example here: "and wider FIFA corruption.[330][6]"
  • Fixed. I'll have a skim to see if this happens elsewhere. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "In December 2022, FIFA World Cup" - just "the World Cup"?
  • Indeed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Bahrain, the United Arab Emirates and Yemen" - the sentence before has an Oxford comma, this one has not, needs to be consistent.
  • This has already been removed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "worker conditions ,the rights of LGBT fans" - comma placement
  • Ditto Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "walked back on both commitments." - what exactly did this entail? how were those issues handled in the end?
  • Removed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "This also led to concerns about what other commitments may be rolled back." - if nothing else happened, then this sentence can just be scrapped.
  • Removed Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "with initial plans for air-conditioned stadiums giving way to a potential date switch from summer to November and December" - this is the first time the article mentions that the tournament was originally supposed to happen in summer, this should have been brought up much earlier.
  • That's not exactly true. The schedule does mention that it's in a different time, and why that is. I don't think many ever thought they'd be able to run a summer event. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• Migrant workers: "with the state accused of sportswashing in hosting the World Cup" - already mentioned above.
  • Removed Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "Better working conditions are now negotiable." - when exactly is "now"?
  • Merged the two sentences to show it's around that poll. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "they would seek compensation from FIFA" - did this eventually happen?
  • They came to agreement, I believe. I think it's notable enough that two countries threatened legal action for hosting a tournament in the winter. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "The Sunday Times published bribery allegations based on a leak of millions of secret documents.The Sunday Times published bribery allegations based on a leak of millions of secret documents." - When did this happen?`
  • It happened in 2014. I thought that would be obvious and would want to avoid proseline. Can put in June 2014 if required. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

I think that would be wise, considering the next earlier mention of a time is two paragraphs before, so it's not really clear. Zwerg Nase (talk) 08:52, 7 September 2023 (UTC)

• "by racism in British media" - missing a "the"
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "Zürich, Switzerland" - is the country necessary? It is not there in the bidding section, where Zürich is already mentioned, so I would scrap it here as well.
  • I've added the country to the original, and scrapped it here. Not everyone will know where Zurich is. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "of at least a $150 million (USD)" - (USD) is redundant.
  • Indeed. Removed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "Of those arrested, $40 million was forfeited under guilty please." - this sentence sounds weird, like the money was arrested.
  • Reworked. I did like the "guilty please". Very polite. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Hahaha, didn't even catch that one! :D With how many S do you spell innocent? Zwerg Nase (talk) 08:52, 7 September 2023 (UTC)

• "was sentenced to 16 months in prison due to the corruption in 2022." - it would be better to cite the exact charge that he was convicted of.
  • Added Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "a German journalist named Peter Rossberg" - just "German journalist Peter Rossberg"
  • Done Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "who claimed to have obtained the report, wrote that the report" - report twice, replace with "it"
  • Reworded to make better Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• "Wahl reportedly received death threats for wearing the shirt, and his brother said he believes Wahl's later death was the result of foul play, implicating the Qatari government as playing a role." - Since these conspiracy theories later turned out to be unfounded, I would scrap them completely here. There is no connection between his death and the LGBTQ issue, so all information on this should be removed from this section.
  • Sure. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• The photo with the Women, Life, Freedom slogan is in the LGBT section, but should be moved down to the next one.
• Iran: no mention of the team's silent protest?
  • my understanding is that the protest was against their own domestic situation, rather than the World Cup as a whole.Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

True, but the audience protests were about that as well, I would argue that players protesting is more relevant to the World Cup than spectators doing the same. Zwerg Nase (talk) 08:52, 7 September 2023 (UTC)

• Jewish: again, a problem here with information appearing multiple times, like the fact about kosher food. Please merge into one.
  • I've tried my best with this. There's a specific sentence I've removed that seemed to be superfluous. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:55, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Sources

Will do some more spotchecks later, but for now:

• Generally, I am a bit concerned about the sourcing here, several issues have been noted above.
  • I've removed/replaced any sources you've mentioned (so far). Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:13, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• In a lot of instances, the source parameters are not fully filled out, lacking publisher, dates, access dates, and so fourth. A general sweep through all sources is needed to address this.
  • I'll do a sweep, but the automated tools are all coming up blank, so don't expect perfection over 450-odd refs. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:13, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
• Some foreign language sources have trans-titles, but many have not, these should be filled out as well.
  • I'll see if I can get the ones that are there. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:13, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
    • I think I got all of these Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 11:36, 22 August 2023 (UTC)

More to follow. Zwerg Nase (talk) 07:48, 16 August 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for taking a look at such a long and in depth article Zwerg Nase. I have replied to the above, and I'm just going through the sources to fix up the ones that aren't quite finished. Let me know if there is more I need to look at. :) Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:56, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Did you have anything more for me Zwerg Nase? Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 12:11, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

Hi Zwerg Nase - not to chase, but was there anything more? Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:49, 29 August 2023 (UTC)

@Lee Vilenski: Sorry, was way more busy over the past week than I thought I would be. I am happy with the prose now, still some minor concerns about the sources though. Some are missing parameters such as release date, retrieval date, author (where available). I don't think there are many, I've noticed #4, #192, maybe you could do a quick scan if you find any others? Then I would be happy to promote. Good work so far! Zwerg Nase (talk) 08:56, 7 September 2023 (UTC)

Sure. I don't mind taking a look - fair warning, I edit almost exclusively on mobile now, so scrutinising sources for formatting (especially on large sized articles) can be troublesome. I will need to find some time with a PC to make these changes. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:29, 10 September 2023 (UTC)

I have been away with some personal stuff - I can't remember where we got with this review, did we come to a conclusion Zwerg Nase? Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 08:38, 15 November 2023 (UTC)

@Lee Vilenski @Zwerg Nase I'm just going through the oldest GANs and found this one. It sounds like it's very close to being wrapped up and is just waiting for some minor fixes on some references. Zwerg, if I may be so bold, if Lee is having technical issues editing this and you know what you're looking for, perhaps you could just make the changes yourself so this can get moved along? RoySmith (talk) 17:39, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

Zwerg Nase - any ideas if there was anything else you needed from me? I've lost track as to what is required. I think we are all but there. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 16:36, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

@Lee Vilenski: Sorry, had little time to check Wikipedia the last couple of weeks. Sources are still my issue here. 305 is missing publisher and date, 306 is missing publisher and retrieval date as well as title translation, 312 is missing retrieval date, 317 "Eurosport" should be capitalized and title given in French with translation, 402 and 403 are questionable since it's YouTube videos (maybe find a better source here?), 406 missing retrieval date. Those are all I can find right now. Zwerg Nase (talk) 08:14, 2 January 2024 (UTC)

Cool, should be done. I've fixed 305, 306, 317 and removed 406 (metro is unreliable). One of the YouTube videos is a direct interview with a reliable source, which should be fine, the other is from Sky News, an RS. It being in video form is irrelevant. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 09:46, 2 January 2024 (UTC)

@Zwerg Nase, I see this is still outstanding, are you ready to pass this? -- asilvering (talk) 02:25, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

@Asilvering: Looks good now, passing :) Zwerg Nase (talk) 14:34, 4 March 2024 (UTC)