Talk:Bullying

Recent image added

I feel that the recent image added here is inappropriate for this page. I would remove it but the page is protected. The reason I don't like it is because the cameras are almost certainly not there to prevent bullying. The cameras are most likely there to catch kids ditching, to act as a witness to traffic accidents, to catch careless drivers, etc. I hardly doubt they are meant for bully prevention. 80.237.132.153 (talk) 02:02, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

I totally agree with you. --MW talk contribs 16:05, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

That may be the case if the cameras were only in the parking lot, but I'm assuming they're in the buildings and elsewhere on campus as well since Charlotte High School (Punta Gorda, Florida) is under the same district as Port Charlotte High School, and actually the only cameras our school has at all is the ones in B building. Playing devil's advocate, another likely purpose is to watch vandals in the rough neighborhood that school is located in. PCHS-NJROTC ^(Messages) 13:57, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

Serial Bullying

The serial bully

Identifying the psychopath or sociopath in our midst including the socialised psychopathic manager

"All cruelty springs from weakness." (Seneca, 4BC-AD65)

"Most organisations have a serial bully. It never ceases to amaze me how one person's divisive, disordered, dysfunctional behaviour can permeate the entire organisation like a cancer." Tim Field

"The truth is incontrovertible; malice may attack it, ignorance my deride it, but in the end, there it is." Winston Churchill

"Lack of knowledge of, or unwillingness to recognise, or outright denial of the existence of the serial bully is the most common reason for an unsatisfactory outcome of a bullying case for both the employee and employer. I estimate one person in thirty, male or female, is a serial bully." Tim Field

The Serial Bully

Most cases of bullying involve a serial bully - one person to whom all the dysfunction can be traced. The serial bully has done this before, is doing it now - and will do it again. Investigation will reveal a string of predecessors who have either left unexpectedly or in suspicious circumstances, have taken early or ill-health retirement, have been unfairly dismissed, have been involved in disciplinary or legal action, or have had stress breakdowns. Serial bullies exploit the recent frenzy of downsizing and reorganisation to hinder recognition of the pattern of previous cases.

The serial bully in the workplace is often found in a job which is a position of power, has a high administrative or procedural content but little or no creative requirement, and which provides opportunities for demonstrating a "caring" or "leadership" nature.

Introduction to the serial bully

Embittered by an abusive upbringing, seething with resentment, irritated by others' failure to fulfil his or her superior sense of entitlement, and fuelled by anger resulting from rejection, the serial bully displays an obsessive, compulsive and self-gratifying urge to displace their uncontrolled aggression onto others whilst exhibiting an apparent lack of insight into their behaviour and its effect on people around them. Jealousy and envy motivate the bully to identify a competent and popular individual who is then controlled and subjugated through projection of the bully's own inadequacy and incompetence. When the target asserts their right not to be bullied, a paranoid fear of exposure compels the bully to perceive that person as a threat and hence neutralise and dispose of them as quickly as possible. Once a person has been eliminated there's an interval of between 2 days and 2 weeks before the bully chooses another target and the cycle starts again.

What about Mediation?

Mediation with this type of individual is inappropriate. Serial bullies regard mediation (and arbitration, conciliation, negotiation etc) as appeasement, which they ruthlessly exploit; it allows them to give the impression in public that they are negotiating and being conciliatory, whilst in private they continue the bullying. The lesson of the twentieth century is that you do not appease aggressors.

Avoiding acceptance of responsibility - denial and feigning victimhood

The serial bully is an adult on the outside but a child on the inside; he or she is like a child who has never grown up. One suspects that the bully is emotionally retarded and has a level of emotional development equivalent to a five-year-old, or less. The bully wants to enjoy the benefits of living in the adult world, but is unable and unwilling to accept the responsibilities that go with enjoying the benefits of the adult world. In short, the bully has never learnt to accept responsibility for their behaviour.

When called to account for the way they have chosen to behave, the bully instinctively:

a) denies everything. Variations include Trivialization ("This is so trivial it's not worth talking about...") and the Fresh Start tactic ("I don't know why you're so intent on dwelling on the past" and "Look, what's past is past, I'll overlook your behaviour and we'll start afresh") - this is an abdication of responsibility by the bully and an attempt to divert and distract attention by using false conciliation.

Imagine if this line of defence were available to all criminals ("Look I know I've just murdered 12 people but that's all in the past, we can't change the past, let's put it behind us, concentrate on the future so we can all get on with our lives" - this would do wonders for prison overcrowding).

b) quickly and seamlessly follows the denial with an aggressive counter-attack of counter-criticism or counter-allegation, often based on distortion or fabrication. Lying, deception, duplicity, hypocrisy and blame are the hallmarks of this stage. The purpose is to avoid answering the question and thus avoid accepting responsibility for their behaviour. Often the target is tempted - or coerced - into giving another long explanation to prove the bully's allegation false; by the time the explanation is complete, everybody has forgotten the original question.

Both a) and b) are delivered with aggression in the guise of assertiveness; in fact there is no assertiveness (which is about recognising and respecting the rights of oneself and others) at all. Note that explanation - of the original question - is conspicuous by its absence.

c) in the unlikely event of denial and counter-attack being insufficient, the bully feigns victimhood or feigns persecution by manipulating people through their emotions, especially guilt.

This commonly takes the form of bursting into tears, which most people cannot handle. Variations include indulgent self-pity, feigning indignation, pretending to be "devastated", claiming they're the one being bullied or harassed, claiming to be "deeply offended", melodrama, martyrdom ("If it wasn't for me...") and a poor-me drama ("You don't know how hard it is for me ... blah blah blah ..." and "I'm the one who always has to...", "You think you're having a hard time ...", "I'm the one being bullied...").

Other tactics include manipulating people's perceptions to portray themselves as the injured party and the target as the villain of the piece. Or presenting as a false victim. Sometimes the bully will suddenly claim to be suffering "stress". Alleged ill-health can also be a useful vehicle for gaining attention and sympathy.

By using this response, the bully is able to avoid answering the question and thus avoid accepting responsibility for what they have said or done. It is a pattern of behaviour learnt by about the age of 3; most children learn or are taught to grow out of this, but some are not and by adulthood, this avoidance technique has been practised to perfection.

A further advantage of the denial/counter-attack/feigning victimhood strategy is that it acts as a provocation. The target, who may have taken months to reach this stage, sees their tormentor getting away with it and is provoked into an angry and emotional outburst after which the bully says simply "There, I told you s/he was like that". Anger is one of the mechanisms by which bullies (and all abusers) control their targets. By tapping in to and obtaining an inappropriate release of pent-up anger the bully plays their master stroke and casts their victim as villain.

When called to account for the way they have chosen to behave, mature adults do not respond by bursting into tears. If you're dealing with a serial bully who has just exhibited this avoidance tactic, sit passively and draw attention to the pattern of behaviour they've just exhibited, and then the purpose of the tactic. Then ask for an answer to the question.

Bullies also rely on the denial of others and the fact that when their target reports the abuse they will be disbelieved ("are your sure this is really going on?", "I find it hard to believe - are you sure you're not imagining it?"). Frequently targets are asked why they didn't report the abuse before, and they will usually reply "because I didn't think anyone would believe me." Sadly they are often right in this assessment. Because of the Jekyll & Hyde nature, compulsive lying, and plausibility, no-one can - or wants - to believe it. Click here for a detailed explanation of the target's reluctance to report abuse.

Denial features in most cases of sexual assault, as in the case of Paul Hickson, the UK Olympic swimming coach who sexually assaulted and raped teenage girls in his care over a period of 20 years or more. When his victims were asked why they didn't report the abuse, most replied "Because I didn't think anyone would believe me". Abusers confidently, indeed arrogantly, rely on this belief, often aggressively inculcating (instilling) the belief ("No-one will ever believe you") just after the sexual assault when their victim is in a distressed state.

Targets of bullying in the workplace often come up against the same attitudes by management when they report a bullying colleague. In a workplace environment, the bully usually recruits one or two colleagues (sometimes one is a sleeping partner - see Affairs below) who will back up the bully's denial when called to account.

Reflection

Serial bullies harbour a particular hatred of anyone who can articulate their behaviour profile, either verbally or in writing - as on this page - in a manner which helps other people see through their deception and their mask of deceit. The usual instinctive response is to launch a bitter personal attack on the person's credentials, lack of qualifications, and right to talk about personality disorders, psychopathic personality etc, whilst preserving their right to talk about anything they choose - all the while adding nothing to the debate themselves.

Serial bullies hate to see themselves and their behaviour reflected as if they are looking into a mirror.

Projection

Bullies project their inadequacies, shortcomings, behaviours etc on to other people to avoid facing up to their inadequacy and doing something about it (learning about oneself can be painful), and to distract and divert attention away from themselves and their inadequacies. Projection is achieved through blame, criticism and allegation; once you realise this, every criticism, allegation etc that the bully makes about their target is actually an admission or revelation about themselves.

This knowledge can be used to perceive the bully's own misdemeanours; for instance, when the allegations are of financial or sexual impropriety, it is likely that the bully has committed these acts; when the bully makes an allegation of abuse (such allegations tend to be vague and non-specific), it is likely to be the bully who has committed the abuse. When the bully makes allegations of, say, "cowardice" or "negative attitude" it is the bully who is a coward or has a negative attitude.

In these circumstances, the bully has to understand that if specious and insubstantive allegations are made, the bully will also be investigated.

A VERY good resource is http://www.bullyonline.org/ [1] —Preceding unsigned comment added by Douglaslewis777 (talk • contribs) 14:45, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Redundant?

Isn't bullying 'serial' by definition? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.194.238.22 (talk) 13:42, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

The plus side

I think that there should be a section outlining the plus sides of bullying, both for bully and target.

If you want references, here are four:

http://www.kimberlyswygert.com/archives/001765.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/564923.stm

http://www2.canada.com/news/standing+bullies/1418791/story.html?id=801242

http://www.medindia.net/news/Child-Development-Academician-Says-Bullying-Is-Beneficial-To-Kids-46992-1.htm

Allthisforasoda (talk) 00:38, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

The author who says that bulling is good for kids compares bullying to "boisterous banter or everyday playground disputes". The author further thinks that bullying helps prepare kids for later in life. As an adult, if someone treats me the way that a bully treats a student, I'd call the police. The author thinks that dealing with things in the exact opposite way that they will have to do in adult life will prepare them for adult life.--RLent (talk) 15:58, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

I agree

I completely agree, this needs to be mentioned in some way. WUTCOSTM (talk) 22:54, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Agreed. Needs a section with "Some claimed positive effects" or similar. "Controversy", perhaps. I was bullied, and have bullied. Some of it was dead wrong, but a very small amount of it served to prepare me for a rough world full of hate - and 12 years in military/security/mercenary activity. From googling around a bit you get the gamut of opinions, from over-protective mothers to extreme heteronormative religiously sourced pro-bullying, with some actual sense in between. The controversial opinions should at least be presented. Pär Larsson (talk) 19:03, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

It probably relates to coping strategies. There are a lot of ways that people can respond to abuse or bullying, some responses can be constructive and some negative - it depends on the severity and nature of bullying and character of the victim. But i dont think you can generalise and prescribe a bit of bullying as a positive therapeutic experience. There is a danger that the idea that bullying is therapeutic would be used as an excuse by a bully to bully, saying for example "its for your own good". --Penbat (talk) 19:15, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

I would invite you to spend some time studying or experiencing many (most?) military basic and some advanced (the "special" or highly physical ones) training programs. What you're basically looking at there (SERE, basic training, BUD/S, SF, Recon, Spetznaz, Legion, SAS, SBS, Royal Marines etc.) is institutionalized bullying. You'll see people getting psychologically broken down into their component parts, then rebuilt into very efficient cohesive fighting units. Key word "units" - as in, "united" and acting as one. Now, it would of course be possible to design these training programs without such bullying and degradations, but to my knowledge no-one has ever tried in any serious, large-scale way, for most long-term career military professionals would find that to be silly and ineffective, simply not worth the trouble or time when the general model works so well. Granted, that's just my own experience after 12+ years working with 10+ different nationalities' military professionals. I suppose that would be anecdotal and original research. Pär Larsson (talk) 20:33, 19 September 2011 (UTC)

TV show

There's a show called Bully Beatdown which invites "bullies" to get into a fight with a professional fighter. 154.5.62.152 (talk) 07:03, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

True, but...

That show is mindless entertainment, and the 'bullies' are quite possibly actors. While i'm not knocking the show, it doesn't deserve any serious mention —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.194.238.22 (talk) 13:41, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

First, the victims don't fight the bullies. A person with fighting experience is selected to fight the bully. Second, the bullies are not actors. My thought on the show? Kids need to be empowered to stand up for themselves, and shoud fight back only when it is needed to prevent getting injured. But plain old "fighting fire with fire" just burns everybodies house down. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.79.194.48 (talk) 17:53, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

Phoebe Prince

The 9 indictments issued yesterday by District Attorney Schiebel in western Massachusetts brings a new chapter to dealing with 'bullying'. Hopefully you will have time to add a section on 'criminal liability'. I believe the Phoebe case is the seminal event for new legal ramifications for such acts. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.151.103.19 (talk) 16:55, 30 March 2010 (UTC)

My Experiences

Hi,if any one is reading this, I have suffered from bullying at my school. My friends tell me that I am so butiful and that they are just jelous, but sometimes I really just think that they are saying it. A few days ago I was sitting in a seat in the front of the class and a few girls behind me were talking about how fat I was, now I am 6 feet and 4 inches tall and way 90 pounds and even I do not think I'm fat, and they were talking loud so every one could here them. When I said oh and pretended not to be affended by it they all laughed. The reasin that they did this was beceause there not mean but the boys were right behind them. What girls do is put other girls down to make them look cooler in front of the boys. I have talked about this to some of the boys and thay do not think this is cool at all. Girls mostly do it to girls that their crush likes. One girl keeps on being mean to me just beceause the person they like likes me. In the past week I have been told that I am fat , I have no friends, go die in a dich , you are so mean, you are such an idiot, who cares what you think, go tell your imaginary friend -we don't care , go get a life , what a looser, I hate you, and your a "female dog". Oh, and this was a good week. Amasingly this has not realy affected me, i know I have wicked thick skin, but I am very close with my mom and she is appauled by theese actions. In Massachusetts, a few girls have killed them selves beceause of people doing things like this, but for me it has not gotten to this poit YET. My addvise is surround your self with friends, talk to an adult about it, and what you think is the only thing that matters. And if people are talking about you behind your back , just now that it is either a lie or something you already know ,beceause who knows you better then you know your self. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Luv448) (talk • contribs) 01:56, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Ideology and the attempt to "naturalize" bullying.

Before an article like this gets locked, it should be scrutinized for (plainly awkward and) totally uncited, unsupported comments like "Bullying can occur in any context in which human beings interact with each other." This is ideology, and an attempt to make bullying seem like human nature--like an inevitable problem. Sociologists, and most people who take the time to read whole books and stuff, know this is (at least likely to be) nonsense--on Israeli kibbutzim, for example, where adults were not in constant economic competition against each other (as they are in American society and other viciously competitive capitalist societies today) social scientists have noted an absence of bullying among their children in school--there is a natural "pecking order" on the playground, but it never needs to be reinforced with humiliation or physical abuse.

We need to be careful of where our (again, totally uncited) ideas come from, and ask ourselves what their real motivations are. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.161.14.221 (talk) 17:59, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

"Bullying can occur in any context in which human beings interact with each other." means name any context (such as school or workplace etc) and there is the potential that bullying will occur. But it does not mean that bullying is inevitable.--Penbat (talk) 18:18, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

Ijime - Japan

I am surprised that this unpleasant Japanese cultural phenomenon is not even mentioned in this article. In fact should have it's own article. It is a very big problem in schools. These are papers on this very emotive subject subject. Ijime: A Social Illness of Japan by Akiko Dogakinai or Nature and correlates of Ijime—Bullying in Japanese middle school by Motoko Akiba. Ijime can get so bad that some children have even killed themselves. BBC School bullying in Japan

Edit request from Johnbmcdonald, 14 June 2010

{{editsemiprotected}} Please add Bully Solutions to the external references section <a href="http://www.bullysolutions.com">Bully Solutions</a> Thanks Johnbmcdonald (talk) 18:39, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

 Not done: This is External Link Spam. -- /DeltaQuad|Notify Me\ 20:12, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

This is not external link spam. I work very hard on this website and its a relevant resource for people suffering from and dealing with bullying. -John McDonald

I was sympathetic anyway as the chargeable publications only form a small part of the site, but looking at http://www.bullysolutions.com/index.php/bullying-books more closely, although you list yourself as the author in each case, on closer inspection they are actually written by other authors. Please clarify this.--Penbat (talk) 20:31, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

My apologies.. I am new to Joomla and am still learning how to configure the site. Joomla meant that I created the article in which that information exists. It was not my intention to imply that I am the author of those resources. I have adjusted it. I am the author of the significant amount of research listed down the left side of the website. There are a number of articles written by three other guest authors who are noted as the author on each article. (down the right side of the site under the "Help a bully" section, you'll find the author's credits listed at the top of each article. - John McDonald - 11:22am, 20 June, 2010 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.12.210.22 (talk) 16:23, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

I didnt think that you had an ulterior motive anyway - but /DeltaQuad| obviously assumed that you were the author of the publications listed for sale. As you are not there is no question that this is spam so I have just added your link. --Penbat (talk) 17:53, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

Thank you - John McDonald 18:20, 20 June, 2010 (CST) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.12.210.22 (talk)

Edit request from June 19th 2010

Although it's an unpopular ideal, i think we should have a section about the plus sides of bullying.

The links posted above by Allthisforasoda should serve as suitable references:

http://www.kimberlyswygert.com/archives/001765.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/564923.stm

http://www2.canada.com/news/standing+bullies/1418791/story.html?id=801242

http://www.medindia.net/news/Child-Development-Academician-Says-Bullying-Is-Beneficial-To-Kids-46992-1.htm

It should be said that although bullying is generally viewed as bad, there are plus sides to it.

Kill me when i die (talk) 17:40, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

No chance. It is well understood that the bully gains psychological benefits from bullying (so it is good from their point of view) but it is always at the expense of the victim. The idea that it is also good for victims is widely discredited and WP:FRINGE.--Penbat (talk) 17:57, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

You say that it's well understood that the bully gains benefits yet it's nowhere in the article. I think that that deserves a mention.

You also say that the idea that there any benefits for the target is widely discredited yet there are four citations above. I think it should be mentioned that there ARE benefits, yet they are widely considered to be outweighed by the harm Kill me when i die (talk) 20:58, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

This is like saying the plus side of rape is that it feels good for the rapist. Sysys (talk) 10:46, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

bullying in the home

4th paragraph: "Bullying can occur in any context in which human beings interact with each other. This includes school, church, the workplace, home and neighborhoods". I personally agree with the idea that a parent beating a child (and other forms of parent->child abuse) constitute(s) a horrible form of bullying, but I suspect that when most people talk about bullying they mean either outside the home or perhaps if within the home then between siblings. (Not that I think it *should* only be used this way, just that I think it is used this way.)

I'm curious to hear what other people think. --TyrS (talk) 13:22, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Different people have different views as to precisely what is and what isnt bullying. Whatever it is, it is a subset of abuse. It is often thought of as a particular style of abuse, most commonly identified in school and the workplace. In general i think bullying approximates to psychological abuse (which can occur in any context including the home). A child may get "bullied" by a strict authoritarian parent but if there is no sex or violence involved it is not likely to be considered child abuse.--Penbat (talk) 13:44, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Don't forget siblings. There can be some serious bullying between siblings as well. Lova Falk talk 08:16, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

For sure but my basic point still applies, sibling abuse is commonly differentiated from sibling bullying as sibling abuse is normally considered to involve sex and/or violence in addition to the psychological and verbal abuse of sibling bullying.--Penbat (talk) 09:31, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

Yes, I meant sibling bullying rather than sibling abuse. Saying mean things over and over again just to make the sibling sad, make a sibling feel excluded, play nasty tricks, etc etc.Lova Falk talk 10:02, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

I would tend to separate parental abuse from bullying. It may be a degree of rankism, but not bullying in pure.

Honest opinion, i think too many things are stuck under the umbrella of bullying, parental abuse being one, so i think keep them separate. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kill me when i die (talk • contribs) 11:44, 27 June 2010 (UTC)

Sticks & Stones...

May break my bones, but words can scar forever... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 156.34.182.158 (talk) 18:32, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

Bullying involving repeated acts

I propose that the definition should be changed to either Bullying is an act of abuse that can but not always be repeated over time that involves a real or perceived imbalance of power with the more powerful individual or group abusing those who are less powerful. or Bullying is an act of discrimination that can but not always be repeated over time that involves a real or perceived imbalance of power with the more powerful individual or group abusing those who are less powerful. I believe it should be changed because the previous definition "Bullying is a form of abuse. It comprises repeated acts over time that involves a real or perceived imbalance of power with the more powerful individual or group abusing those who are less powerful." has been challenged by at least one expect in the field, Barbara Coloroso,in this video at 34:37-35:03. I agree with her that calling it a repeated act of abuse is untrue. I think once being called (insert hate term here)is bullying, one shove in the hall is an act of bullying, one act of destroying a students property is an act of bullying. Tydoni (talk) 22:00, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Legal Bullying

Is there any info on legal bullying? The article mentions laws against bullying, but what about the legal-system-as-bully - such as suing a person out of revenge, or excessive amounts of money awarded, or judicial bullying? 207.216.13.209 (talk) 00:19, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

That is Legal abuse which needs to be expanded sometime as a separate article. --Penbat (talk) 09:19, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

Link to German wiki wrong!

German translation is 'Mobbing' - not 'Schikane'. 212.41.82.203 (talk) 05:44, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

 Done Looking at the two articles, I agree that de:Mobbing is the article that parallels this one. I've changed the interwiki link. —C.Fred (talk) 14:48, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from 67.49.26.207, 27 October 2010

{{edit semi-protected}}

Extended content
Resources Thursday's Child offers a 24/7 hotline for children who are victims of bullying. 1 (800) USA KIDS / 1 (800) 872-5437

67.49.26.207 (talk) 21:14, 27 October 2010 (UTC)

 Not done: Although I understand the good nature of this request, Wikipedia is not for advertising services or products, it is an encyclopedia. Also, that number is US only and Wikipedia is global. Thanks, Stickee (talk) 22:11, 27 October 2010 (UTC)

Characteristics of likely targets of chronic bullying

A lot of this section is seriously naive, implying that it is often to a significant degree the fault of the victim. Also standing up to the bully is often very naive advice, bullies will often escalate the bullying if confronted but give up if the victim doesnt respond. This is the complete opposite to what is said here. That is because they thrive on seeing the victim's discomfort and get bored if they dont respond. Also there have been plenty of news stories of a victim taking on bullies in the street and then getting killed by them. The best advice to handle bullies is to respond in a carefully considered indirect way. Yes it is true that victims with a victim mentality who have been previously bullied are more likely to be picked on, but that only covers a minority of victims and they are still not to blame in any way, it is just the bully looking for vulnerable targets. --Penbat (talk) 14:07, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

Do you have some references for that? LewisWasGenius (talk) 16:20, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

not offhand although www.bullyonline.org for one supports much of this perspective. My perspective is self evident. People who cross, criticise bullies or dare speak up against them, for example in gangs, frequently get beaten up. Alternatively if you keep your head down and tow the line you are unlikely to get harrassed. Often if you report a bully, there is retaliation and intimidation.--Penbat (talk) 16:41, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

I guess it depends on the situation. My own experiences have suggested that the opposite is true in many cases. I'll check out that site. Generally speaking we don't contradict a sourced statement and replace it with our personal views, however well-founded they may be. LewisWasGenius (talk) 18:02, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

Considering that that site seems to go directly against the views of other sources, I don't think we should change it unless we get a consensus that the existing sources are flawed. LewisWasGenius (talk) 19:11, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

You need to dig deeper. Bullies are often narcissists and criticising a narcissist often triggers narcissistic rage. Narcissists prefer people to be codependent and compliant to give them narcissistic supply. This relationship between bullies, narcissists and psychopaths needs to be reinforced in this article. I personally havent yet got round to it. Reliable academic sources reinforcing these relationships do exist but more commonly the academics who study "bullying" are not the same types of academics who study narcissism, psychopathy and personality disorders. Bullying is just a social construct which is used to describe certain types of abuse and abuse is largely caused by people with personality disorders. The idea that bullies one day arrived from outer space is naive. It is all understood in terms of well established psychological processes. There is about a century of theory since the days of Freud explaining the mechanics of bullying (Psychological projection for example) and the personality types of bullies.--Penbat (talk) 19:27, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

Well, like I said, I don't think we should reverse the position of the article without consensus that that needs to be done. I don't see any agreement among bullying resources on this issue. As far as the psychological factors you mention, wouldn't they be better addressed on their respective pages? This article is about the "social construct" of bullying. LewisWasGenius (talk) 19:43, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

Its a 2 way process, bullying to narcissism and vice versa. Anyway to approach this from another angle, the entire text in this section is based on the work of Jay Banks and he doesnt look like a very reliable source. He isnt exactly an academic heavyweight is he ? Yes he wrote a dissertation paper on bullying but thats it. http://jaybanks.com/credentials-references. It doesnt compare to academics who devote their whole lives to the study of the subject. Banks is partly an entertainer. His approach to bullying is not without merit but it is very simplistic. Obviously, however, young children can only be expected to understand the very simple version but it is just not good enough for Wikipedia which needs academic credibility. I havent checked properly yet but i am dubious whether much of the text in the section is even covered by the Jay Banks link.--Penbat (talk) 20:02, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

The text looks to be an abstraction and synthesis of 15 of his videos. The refs need to precisely identify exactly which videos the information came from so it can be checked properly. Otherwise it is almost impossible to check. --Penbat (talk) 20:12, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

After a quick glance-over, I agree that the Jay Banks link isn't enough to justify the section. Maybe it should be removed entirely and remade from scratch if that information is really needed. The body of the section doesn't seem very relevant to "characteristics of bullying victims" anyway. LewisWasGenius (talk) 20:21, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

Penbat, thanks for pointing out that all targets are not chosen for their perceived vulnerabilities. I've added the second paragraph which attempts to remedy your valid point on this. What do you think?Scott P. (talk) 17:24, 27 November 2010 (UTC)

Lewis, specifically what would you think should be changed or removed and for what reason? Scott P. (talk) 17:28, 27 November 2010 (UTC)

I did a fairly major edit to this section in November 2010 attempting to address both of your legitimate concerns, adding the requested refs, and making it clear that many bullying targets are selected on a completely random basis. Since neither one of you appears to have any further questions about this section, not answering any of my questions here, I've gone ahead and deleted the "disputed template" for this section. Thanks for pointing out good ways to improve this section. Scott P. (talk) 16:23, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

Reference 18 is not working

It's link http://www.ncsl.org/programs/educ/SchBullying.htm is dead. A mark "reference needed" is needed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.250.74.141 (talk) 00:04, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

Repaired broken link. Thanks for reporting this. Scott P. (talk) 01:15, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from Haltnowca, 7 December 2010

{{edit semi-protected}} http://www.haltnow.ca. Humanity Against Local Terrorism [HALT] - This website is designed to help educate and stop bullying, abuse and domestic violence. HALT was created in order to help people in finding a solution to stop the local terrorism or bullying, abuse and domestic violence within our communities. We designed this website to encourage, aid and support education, prevention and services for the bullied and abused victims throughout each of our communities. We cannot be silent anymore; we have to stand up and say HALT to all forms of bullying, abuse and domestic violence. Together, we can create a voice loud enough to HALT these senseless acts of violence against our children, families and friends. We are the solution, we have the answer, and together we have the power to say HALT. We Have to make a stand and work together and put a stop to the threat of BULLYING (child, cyber, workplace, homophobic, sports, cultural), ABUSE (child, wife, husband, elderly, parental) and DOMESTIC VIOLENCE within each of our communities. Haltnowca (talk) 05:21, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

 Not done: If an independent party points out some merits to this website, it might warrant addition. However, the request as it stands now is self-promotion. —C.Fred (talk) 05:45, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Missing words in section "Effects of bullying on those who are targeted"

I just read this section and noticed that a sentence beginning with "Sadly, the majority of these gifted children..." after ref. 15 is missing words. Could someone who watches and probably knows the development of this article better than me fix it please? --Dead3y3 (talk) 01:47, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

Worst humans in history?

"Numerous dictators and invaders throughout history have tried to justify their bullying behaviour by claiming they themselves were bullied. Although it is no justification for bullying; many of the worst humans in history have been bullies and victims of bullying." There is no way this can be called unbiased. "Worst humans"?? Anchorsaur (talk) 20:02, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Yes this is rubbish. For a start, bullying is an unclearly defined subset of abuse where in some cases adult abusers were themselves abused as a child. --Penbat (talk) 20:12, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Also citation is lacking in this section The Consigliere (talk) 00:27, 2 April 2011 (UTC)

Workplace revenge

The article Workplace revenge would be worth adding as a link. From my experience some bullying may be revenge where the reason for the revenge is unclear or unknown. 92.15.24.121 (talk) 13:23, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

Workplace revenge and other related interesting concepts are included on Template:Aspects of workplaces which as accessible from Workplace bullying etc--Penbat (talk) 13:40, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

Add [:es:Acoso psicológico]

Add es:Acoso psicológico please —Preceding unsigned comment added by 147.83.83.150 (talk) 08:08, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

Bullying is a form of abuse. It involves repeated acts over time attempting to create or enforce one person's (or group's) power over another person (or group) , thus an "imbalance of power".

This is basically what Wikipedia's editors and administrators do.

207.237.248.85 (talk) 03:58, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

Idea for Page Addition

List Bullying and Cyber-Bullying Helpline 1 (800) USA-KIDS. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Minerva Meybridge (talk • contribs) 23:25, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

Looking over this bullying page it is outlined to include many, if not all aspects of bullying. Yet, I have been interested in this topic for many years. When looking under the heading "Types of Bullying" there are 7 types listed. These are the most common types of bullying. Thus, I wonder if it would be beneficial to those using the site to include less common types of bullying under this heading. The site http://www.bullyonline.org/workbully/bully.htm includes 12 types of bullying and goes into further discussion about Cyber bullying. This are additions I would be interested in adding to this page to broaden the scope of information on this topic. Amber Lynne 86 (talk) 22:08, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

That site is generally workplace bullying orientated rather than general bullying. Those 12 types are already covered here Workplace_bullying#Forms_of_workplace_bullying--Penbat (talk) 22:17, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

Cyber Bullying

The Cyber bullying section is not very detailed, I am unsure if this is helpful to those looking to expand their understanding on Cyber bullying. It appears that the definition from the educator is very helpful, yet I wonder if www.bullyonline.org or other sites that discuss types of bullying and their characteristics could help expand on this type of bullying. There are few locations that are discussed for this type of bullying under this heading. For example, I wonder if there is more information available on cyber bullying through social networking sites as this has increased and become more of problem in current events. Amber Lynne 86 (talk) 02:32, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

there only needs to be a short summary here. There is much more info at Cyber-bullying--Penbat (talk) 13:25, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from Summer44, 19 February 2011

{{edit semi-protected}}

External links

• Canada Anti Bullying Program

Summer44 (talk) 15:16, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

 Done →♠Gƒoley↔Four♣← 18:18, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

Edit Request

Please edit/add these links:
[[nl:Pesten_(gedrag)]]
[[de:mobbing]]

 Done ViezeRick (talk) 11:02, 31 March 2011 (UTC)

Suggestion for change of unencyclopedic paragraph

I'd suggest that this paragraph: It is often suggested that bullying behavior has its origin in childhood. As a person who is inclined to act as a bully matures, his or her related behavior patterns will often also mature. Schoolyard pranks and 'rough-housing' may mature into more subtle, yet equally effective adult level activities such as administrative end-runs, well planned and orchestrated attempts at character assassination, or other less obvious, yet equally forceful forms of coercion. ...be replaced with something more neutral, like: Adult bullying may originate in childhood.

Things not encyclopedic: The quotation and source the paragraph introduces does not back up the claims made in the paragraph. An "administrative end-run" isn't necessarily a bullying tactic. It could just as easily be a tactic to get around obstructionist bullying. The word "matures" implies growth. The quotation implies the problem is actually a lack of emotional growth. Adult bullying is considered immature.

68.51.95.69 (talk) 02:56, 3 April 2011 (UTC)

Suggested removal of sentence implying armed students would reduce bullying

I'd suggest removal of this sentence: Institutions may reinforce bullying; for example, by telling targets of bullies they're responsible for defending themselves, but then forcing them to go to school unarmed.

There is certainly no factual consensus that forbidding people in schools to be armed constitutes institutional reinforcement of bullying. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.51.95.69 (talk) 03:14, 3 April 2011 (UTC)

Problems with article

IMO this article has the simplistic idea that bullying relates primarily to children fighting in the playground in particular and the idea that it can be nipped in the bud to stop them growing up as adult bullies. By the teenage years bullying becomes more sophisticated and subtle using psychological tactics - simplistic anti-bullying strategies just wouldnt work. There may also be a bullying culture amongst the principal, teachers and parents in a school so they dont necessarily set a good example. Adult bullying is as common as child bullying and is more sophisticated. Also whether a child bullies probably has more to do with their family upbringing, relating to concepts such as narcissism rather than schools. --Penbat (talk) 09:01, 10 April 2011 (UTC)

Semantics of Bullying in Schools

Bullying is defined as a “conscious, deliberate hostile activity intended to terrorize and harm others through the threat of further aggression.” School-age bullying is not limited to any national, religious, or ethno-cultural group. Statistic show that one out of four students are bullied by a peer, over 160,000 children choose to stay home from school due to the fear of being bullied, and lastly, bullying is responsible for childhood attempted suicides .

While many gender-neutral terms have become popular consciousness, the term bully, remains a linguistic intersex. It has been argued that the term bullying warrants recovery by deriving power from the potential effects of bullying: intimidation, humiliation, coercion, and silencing of the victims .

Bullying is delivered in a number of different forms and is not limited to one gender. Forms include verbal, physical, direct, sexual harassment, and relational bullying. Bullying covers a wide range of age groups but is particularly prominent between the ages of 9-18. Boys tend to do more bullying than girls, especially in the form of physical bullying. However girls are just as guilty. They usually tend to bully in verbal forms .

Understanding the semiotics of school-age bullying may increase the chances of stopping the problem before drastic measures are taken by the victims, such as suicide. Bully, target, and bystander are labels that have been created to help describe and understand the roles of the individuals involved in the vicious cycle. Barbara Coloroso, an expert in the field of bullying prevention, explains that the labels serve as descriptors of a child’s behavior rather than permanently labeling the child .

Bullying is usually associated with an imbalance of power. Typically a bully has a perceived authority over another due to factors such as size, gender, or age . Bullies are not identifiable by their appearance or group identification; rather we need to focus on how they act. The definition of bullying briefly describes actions that are exhibited by an individual that is playing the role of a bully . Boys find motivation for bully from factors such as not fitting in, physically weak, short-tempered, who their friends were, and the clothes they wore. Girls that tend to fall in the role of bullying, result from factors such as, not fitting in, facial appearance, emotional, overweight, and academic status .

Individuals that choose to be a bully are not typically born with the urge to be aggressive. It usually stems from the treatment they receive from authority figures, including parents. Bullies often come from families that use physical forms of discipline . This somewhat turns the tables on the bully, making them the victim in a different environment leading us in the direction that school bullies are victims at home. Unfortunately, this leads to a strategy to assist in coping with daily challenges – bully or be bullied .

To profile a bully is a bit harder than suspected. They are usually viewed as loud and assertive and may even be hostile in particular situations. Bullies are not usually the largest kid in a class, but may be part of the popular or cool kids group . The bullies that are part of a popular group may not come from intense authoritative homes, rather they gain acceptance from the peer group by gaining support to bully a victim, but do view it as no harm is being done .

Much research has been conducted on the profile of a victim making it easier to identify specific behavior. Victims of bullying typically are physically smaller, more sensitive, unhappy, cautious, anxious, quiet, and withdrawn. They are often described as passive or submissive. Possessing these qualities make these individuals vulnerable to being victimized. Unfortunately bullies know that these students will not retaliate, making them an easy target that can be targeted on a daily basis .

A general semantics term called indexing is useful in dealing with the different types of bullying. Indexing is a way to categorize of signs. This allows educators and parents a way to assist in recognizing how bullying behavior varies. By understanding and recognizing the different varieties of behavior it helps to allow flexibility in the responses to the variations .

An interesting result from previous research states that the majority of children possess anti-bullying attitudes. However there is a small amount of children that admire those that bully and show little empathy for those that get bullied .

Despite the large number of individuals that do not agree with bullying practices, there a very few that will intervene on behalf of the victim. These individuals are labeled bystanders and unfortunately usually tend to lean toward the bully’s side. Research states that bystanders are involved in either teasing the target or egging on the bully in 85 percent of the incidents.

However, in most bullying incidents, bystanders usually does nothing. This can be problematic because it allows the bully to continue behaving badly . There are a wide variety of reasons why children choose not to get intervene. Typically they worry that they will make the situation worse or risk becoming the next victim.1 Due to the fear factor that children experience as the bystanders, a decline in anti-bully attitudes the older the child gets has been reported. This points to the urgency for a better understanding of children’s attitudes to bullying and the factors that seem to predict these attitudes .

Due to the urgency to better understand attitudes toward bullying a theory have been introduced to assist; the just world belief theory (BJW). This is the idea that people get what they deserve and deserve what they get. Researchers are using this theory to understand why there is a decline of anti-bullying attitudes. The study determined that children do seek to understand, justify, and rectify the different injustices they come across in everyday life but further research is needed to relate the decline of anti-bullying attitudes being linked to the just world belief theory . —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kkmcbride (talk • contribs) 17:07, 28 April 2011 (UTC)

The unilateral merge from Bullycide

Such merges require consensus. The merge has been unwound. Should a consensus be reached that is a different matter. Two editors have, independently, reverted the merge at each end, by coincidence almost simultaneously. There is sufficient separation between bullying and bullycide to maintain separate articles. Fiddle Faddle (talk) 08:03, 30 April 2011 (UTC)

Rationale for removal of recently added "Semiotics of bullying in schools" section

While some of the articles reported on in this section were interesting, such as psychologist Cheney's article where he reports his "belief" that group bullying is a "constructive process" that ought not be interfered with by those in charge, such odd minority opinions usually require either better scientifically proven documentation such as empirical research results that support Cheney's theory, or else better proof that there are indeed several other psychologists who also subscribe to Cheney's unusual theory before being used as reference material in a Wikipedia article. I've removed this recently added section for this and other reasons until such time as it can be made to more harmoniously fit in with the rest of this article, and Wikipedia standards in general. Scott P. (talk) 19:33, 29 May 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from Tkirktx, 22 June 2011

I'm an employee for SchoolTipline, a national anti-bullying program. Our mission is to empower students so they can take an active role in ending bullying and other violent problems in schools. In fact, we recently intervened to prevent school shooting - the student had a gun with a list of students he wanted to shoot. Our program is research based and has a power web-based engine that utilizes anonymous reporting through the web and text messaging. While the wiki page on bullying is full of information about the effects of bullying, it lacks information about how to combat it. We can provide content to help people know what can be done about bullying in their school, even concrete examples about how schools are solving the problems they face. To learn more about us, check out our website www.schooltipline.com

Tkirktx (talk) 16:52, 22 June 2011 (UTC)

 Not done: I took a casual glance through the website, and I'm not readily finding "information about how to combat" bullying. Accordingly, I don't see enough of a resource here that it meets the WP:EL guidelines. Wikipedia is not a directory of links, and I don't see any reason to single out this service to be listed in the EL section. —C.Fred (talk) 20:26, 22 June 2011 (UTC)

Perhaps if you had any independent third party news sources verifying that lives may have been saved as a result of this same service as you describe, then a reference to this service might be merited in the school shooting article in the form of a reference to such a news source. Likewise in this article, only independent third party news sources, or other similar verifiable independent third party sources of information, are normally either cited as references for an article, or linked to in an External Links section of a Wikipedia article. Thanks for the suggestion though. Scott P. (talk) 10:50, 25 June 2011 (UTC)

additional reference

http://www.youthrelationships.org/ would be a helpful addition to the resources. This is a curriculum based program that has been peer reviewed, published and has demonstrated improved behaviour in adolescents in particular in dating violence but including bullying, homophobia, truancy. It delves into power and control issues that underlie much of what bullying is about. Bll79llb (talk) 17:39, 27 July 2011 (UTC)bll79llb

Edit request from NotOnScript, 27 July 2011

This article links to the File: http://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/File:School_bullying_laws_in_the_United_States.svg The legend in this File does not contain the text "; bullying for other reasons is allowed." This article's legend for this File adds this text in two places. This text should be removed.

In the case of Illinois (for example), it is not true that "bullying for other reasons is allowed." The relevant Illinois state law states (105 ILCS 5/27‑23.7(a)):

"Bullying on the basis of actual or perceived race, color, religion, sex, national origin, ancestry, age, marital status, physical or mental disability, military status, sexual orientation, gender‑related identity or expression, unfavorable discharge from military service, association with a person or group with one or more of the aforementioned actual or perceived characteristics, or any other distinguishing characteristic is prohibited in all school districts and non‑public, non‑sectarian elementary and secondary schools."

In this example regarding the state of Illinois, I don't see any basis for concluding that "bullying for other reasons is allowed."

NotOnScript (talk) 21:35, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

 Done Removed both statements about bullying for other reasons. Jnorton7558 (talk) 07:30, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

Section: Bullying in the MIlitary

The Military said that the rituals that are performed like Hazing is a way for the soldiers to build their characters and roughness that they need to be able to perform in their daily jobs.

{{"Bullying." Wikipedia, The Free Encyclopedia. Wikimedia Foundation, Inc. 2004. 4 October 2011. <http://www.enotes.com/topic/Bullying>.}} KellyCary26 02:48, 5 October 2011 (UTC)

That's not a reliable source - it's copied from Wikipedia anyway. --Demiurge1000 (talk) 03:06, 5 October 2011 (UTC)

Push factor?

The article says "[Bullying] is even a common push factor in migration." But "push factor" is linked to immigration which doesn't immediately explain how bullying is a "push factor" in immigration. Could this be clarified? Thanks! MathewTownsend (talk) 00:08, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

"Yo! Pepper Spray That Nasty Thang!"

File:Jack of Space.gif

"Yo! Pepper Spray That Nasty Thang!"

Jack of Space (talk) 04:50, 1 December 2011 (UTC)